Under plates grout 1

[Chster6]

The metal plate has about 10mm vertical spaces underneath it, is non-shrink grout or epoxy better filler or what other materials can be used to fill it that can take load that can go inside the 10mm spaces?

 

[madmantrapper]

What is the area of the plate? How much load? Are you going to grout in place or is lt going to be able to be lifted and set in grout bed? Can shims be used instead? What is the plates sitting on?

 

[CELinOttawa]

Sika 212 non-metallic, non-shrink grout. Check the product specs to ensure it meets your requirements, but I love that stuff...

 

[Chster6]

The plate is just thin long 40mm angle bar where you support those decoration accent bar frames you see outside building, the load is just very low not even 8kN. It's sitting on concrete. Just need to fill in the 10mm space with something that won't shrink. Would there be a good substitute for non-shrink grout? would epoxy work since these have lower viscosity than non-shrink grout?

 

[dik]

Look into using a flowable grout...

Dik

 

[kylesito]

Non-shrink grout is your best option. There is really nothing readily available that does as good of a job or is as easy to install as it for the application you are talking about.

Is there a specific reason why you want an alternate product?


PE, SE
Eastern United States

"If a builder builds a house for someone, and does not construct it properly, and the house which he built falls in and kills its owner, then that builder shall be put to death!"
~Code of Hammurabi

 

[CELinOttawa]

Sika 212 non-metallic, non-shrink grout. Whatever you do, you need to use a purpose-made product. I've not seen an epoxy product specification that says it is appropriate for filling large areas been two close plates. Why would it ever, when this is what a non-shrink, non-metallic grout is for.

Don't try to reinvent the wheel. Use the grout.

 

[Chster6]

Can non-shrink grout fill in space as small as 10mm? I haven't handled non-shrink grout. Are these wetter or more liquid than concrete grout? It's difficult to insert concrete grout in the 10mm spacing because not all can get inside, this is the reason I was thinking of epoxy.

 

[CELinOttawa]

CHECK THE PRODUCT SPEC but if I remember correctly, the minimum gap IS 10mm.

 

[Chster6]

The sika site noted minimum gap is 25mm (can anyone confirm). This is why I considered epoxy as it can get in the 10mm gap, well?

http://can.sika.com/en/solutions_products/02/02a005/02a005sa50.html

quoting from the product literature

■ Minimum application thickness (neat without additional aggregate): 25 mm (1 in).
■ Maximum application thickness (neat without additional aggregate): 150 mm (6 in). Thicker
applications are possible with the addition of suitable aggregate.

 

[CELinOttawa]

Okay, so I just checked... In keeping with the general screwing we seem to get in North America because of the overall litigiousness around here, we do not have the same specs as I was familiar with in New Zealand.

Sika 212 minimum thickness (flowable) in NZ: 10mm
"" "" in Canada: 25mm (*cough* BS *cough*)

Sika 300 PT (not available in NZ last I knew) minimum thickness 3mm...

Frankly me thinks we are getting the "make them buy the more expensive product" tactic from Sika...

I'd like to hear a TECHNICAL reason why a product is good for certain tolerances in Australasia and lesser ones over here.

 

[hokie66]

You have to have a flowable grout, and build a dam in which to pour the grout. When it comes out the other side, you have filled the gap. But for only a 40 mm wide bar, and this thing is just decorative, I might just use 10 mm galvanized shim plates at the bolts.

 

[Chster6]

If you just use 10 mm galvanized shim plates, it can rust inside, so better to fill it up either with non-shrink grout or epoxy. I haven't handled non-shrink grouts. Why is its viscosity lower or more flowable than concrete paste? what ingredients made this so?

 

[hokie66]

We don't know all the ingredients of premixed grout. These materials are proprietary. Don't even think about making it yourself.

What material is the "40 mm angle bar"? I imagine that 10 plate shims, hot dipped galvanized, would have superior corrosion resistance to that of your decorative frames. One disadvantage of the grout is that it is brittle, thus subject to cracking due to impact. But if that happens, you just grout it again.

 

[Chster6]

Please view attached picture of the decorative frame with grills. It's bolted up, so no problem with attachment. There is just 10mm gap in the angle bar connection to the concrete below. I inserted 10 mm rebar but you can still insert paper to a 0.5 gap below the 10mm rebar. So I plan to remove the bars inserted into the gap and just use non-shrink grout, would it flow into the gap?

 

[hokie66]

Flowable grout will, as I said before. But you have to provide a dam to prevent it going everywhere, and to assure uniform contact. Trying to dry-pack it will probably not work well.

 

[CELinOttawa]

But Hokie, if this user is in North America, they are violating the manufacturer's written instructions by following our advice... For the same product which Australia and New Zealand specs say 10mm is perfectly fine!

 

[dik]

I've used Sikadur in past... have to re-think this a bit... It recommends 1" also... although I've seen it used for less than half this value...

Dik

 

[CELinOttawa]

Dik: That's because it works perfectly fine down to 10mm...

I don't know what Sika is up to other than pushing the more expensive option where available, and being realistic about the cheaper option where they don't market the costly stuff. *sigh*

 

[CELinOttawa]

And just for the record: I still think Sika 212 is the right stuff for this application.