Vehicle packaging techniques 2

[Rarrel]

Hi all,

Can any of you point me in the right direction to find literature relating to vehicle packaging techniques, either web based information or good reference books.

Many thanks
Darrel

 

[KENAT]

No need to double post (probably a glitch, hit the "Inappropriate post?
If so, Red Flag it!" and tell them about it).

What do you mean by vehicle packaging?

I have images of a Car wrapped in birthday paper with a bow on top like on TV commercials, I'm guessing that's not what you mean.

KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...

 

[GregLocock]

Vehicle packaging is the first stage in the design process once somebody has decided which end the engine is going to be and how many whiny passengers you need to squeeze inside it.

So you grab solid models from other cars of each major component and try and fit them all together. The you establish the tradeoff in terms of fuel tank volume vs exhaust volume vs passenger footwell clearance, etc.

Sorry I don't have any references, I suspect it is mostly proprietary.

This is the correct forum for this thread.



Cheers

Greg Locock

SIGlease see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.

 

[btrueblood]

Kenat...I refrained from saying mostly the same thing. Bit my tongue, I did! Now I with I hathn'th.

 

[WGJ]

As Greg says - it's mostly proprietary.

Every vehicle manufacturer will have procedures which stipulate, to some level or another, the steps used in packaging, even down to socket, spanner and hand clearances, although, from what I see these days, some companies don't give a monkey's cuss about how serviceable their products are.
Stuff like torque reactions, engine rock, transmission wid-up, heat clearances etc. will figure in it all.

Solid modelling is today's de facto method of packaging, but there's still a lot to be said for full-size mock-ups at some stage of the design process to see whether an average body can get in/out and whether the engine can actually be installed without hitting every other component under the hood.


Bill

 

[patprimmer]

Here was me thinking you just open the doors and boot and place everything inside, heaviest solid big things first then smaller, lighter softer things on top.

Regards

eng-tips, by professional engineers for professional engineers
Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips Fora.

 

[WGJ]

Tut tut. Mr P.

I am sure there are many that are not involved with either the motor or aero industries that have absolutely no comprehension of the comprexities of squeezing quarts into pint pots.


Bill

 

[kenre]

Alex Iginossis of the original Mini fame had it worked out!

4 people on chairs, close together but comfy, thats the inside dimensions, and when asked how big the wheels needed to be he
held out his hands in the size he wanted and they used a tape measure , 10 inch rims! No computers needed.

http://www.retallickeng.com.au

Was told it couldnt be done, so
i went and did it!

 

[Rarrel]

Cheers Guys

I was also coming to the conclusion of proprietary information, Guess I can stop searching now.

Thanks for the posts (& laugh )

Darrel

 

[GregLocock]

re Mini

...and then you put the welds on the outside of the body because there is no room inside.

I'm not knocking it, Issigonis was one of the few geniusses in the car industry.

Cheers

Greg Locock

SIGlease see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.

 

[BrianPetersen]

... and you put the engine sideways driving the front, because there was no place for a normal axle or drive shaft bouncing around underneath, and the engine is shorter side-to-side than front-to-back.

Issigonis was indeed a genius. Modern cars still mostly use the same layout, but with nowhere near the effectiveness of Issigonis' original design. 'Course, he did not have to contend with collision safety constraints.

 

[WGJ]

I like the Tarmac Test for assessing the effectiveness of engine packaging efficiency with respect to engine serviceability.

It's like this: you open the bonnet/hood of the vehicle in question, lean in until you're about dead centre of the hole and check to see if you can see any tarmac.
If you can't then the engine is likely to be a bitch to work on.

Bill

 

[GregLocock]

The knuckles on both my hands bear witness to Mr Issigonis' priorities.

Cheers

Greg Locock

SIGlease see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.

 

[kenre]

Aparrently the welds were on the outside to allow very easy building of the shell.

The original mini was a masterpiece in my mind.

http://www.retallickeng.com.au

Was told it couldnt be done, so
i went and did it!

 

[KENAT]

OK, I'm familiar with the concept, should have been obvious really.

I know somw aerospace conceptual design books cover this, not sure about automotive. However, as others say any more detailed stuff is likely proprietry.

(Greg, the double post was same post in this forum, I wasn't implying the OP was in the wrong forum.)

KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...

 

[amorrison]

Recommend this book (old - published in 1984)

"Car Design - Structure and Architecture" by Jan P. Norbye

http://www.amazon.com/Car-Design-Ar...=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1208270860&sr=1-1

 

[berkshire]

The knuckles on both my hands bear witness to Mr Issigonis' priorities.
Cheers

Greg Locock

Does this indicate that car designers use the same formula as aircraft designers, 1/16" smaller than a mechanics hand with skin ?
B.E.