What to do about George... 15

[tipsteronline]

The name has been changed to protect the... well, I don't know if "innocent" is really the right... well, anyway, the name has been changed...

George is the manager of a newly established department in the building services group of a multi-disciplined engineering consulting and land-surveying company, in the upper Midwest. George has been in charge of this new department for about two (2) years.

George is a very nice guy. George is very likeable. George has been adjudged competent to practice professional engineering. George is not a very good leadership choice for establishing and growing a department. Examples of this…

George can’t seem to judge project time. When a new project comes in that might reasonably occupy only a third of an engineer’s or drafter’s time, he consistently over-estimates its complexity. It is not uncommon at all to hear George remark, “Oh, are you already done with that?” Part of this is that George may not be used to working on too much of anything larger than strip malls or multi-family structures, himself. (that last remark was culled from conversations with colleagues of George from other offices.)

George can’t judge talent. George has at least one drafter too many on his staff; but in managing with his heart instead of his head cannot bring himself to trim the resources down to what’s necessary. This is a situation that has existed for almost a year, and shows no signs of changing soon; just like our workload. More importantly, George consistently passes the more important work over the brighter, better qualified and more experienced of the two, only to assign it to the dullard. George should recognize that, with one of the drafters still at the earliest stages of development (and not moving forward quickly) and the other drafter at about a decade of experience (and heck-on-wheels fast, accurate and meticulous about self-checking), the one should be working UNDER the other; assuming there were enough work for two drafters in the first place. Instead, George has taken to sending the best drafting talent we could ask for in this region off to other offices to do THEIR drafting work. George is really working hard to validate the existence of the second position, and in the process is on his way to running off the real talent.

George doesn’t seem to know his own role. As a department manager, one might reasonably expect that George would be slightly less billable to projects than his staff engineers; what with all of the marketing that a department manager should be doing. And, even assuming times are slow, George’s first responsibility as department manager is to keep his people busy with whatever work he CAN secure; not keep said work to make himself more billable. Instead, George’s staff engineers have to literally approach him and beg off work from George that he would otherwise squirrel away and keep for himself.

George’s best “clients” are other departments within the company. George’s main marketing strategy is hyper-focused around building and maintaining relationships with THESE people, almost exclusively. George should look around outside the company, and recognize that there are people working for OTHER companies that might actually hire us. These people are called architects. They are usually listed in the Yellow Pages. It’s alright to call them. They might reject you, initially, for some amount of time. It’s still alright to call them. It’s even alright to call them more than once.

George is licensed in a neighboring state in which the company has no department assets of our type. This means that George has the WHOLE state open to him to market. Of course, inexplicably, George chooses to spend virtually NO time marketing in that state. Even our FIRE PROTECTION folks (in other words, PEOPLE WHO DESIGN SPRINKLERS…!) are making money down there, for goodness’ sake…

George is slowly, and very certainly losing the confidence of the people under him. Even a subordinate who has traveled a fairly long road with George thus far has remarked that he has no idea what logic George is employing in even the most routine circumstances; that he has no idea “…what the heck [George] is thinking, at all…” Some of George’s staff are agitated and even upset. It is a fact that there are other department managers who are aware of this discontent and who understand how it is affecting the growth potential for the department and for the building services group in general. However, it seems not to have excited anyone further up the chain of command, to any extent whatsoever. In fact, it even seems that George received something of a pep-talk from some of his higher-ups not too long ago, wherein they voiced their apparent confidence in his ability to lead and develop the department. It is truly an unusual situation; that a department manager should earn such confidence as George has from HIS managers, without first securing and maintaining the confidence of his OWN subordinates. One would suppose that the latter would be far easier to establish than the prior. Strange… very strange, indeed.

George blew a HUGE opportunity to rectify the above-stated confidence issues with ALL of his subordinates, at the recent end-of-year reviews …

George is a very nice guy. George is very likeable. George has been adjudged competent to practice professional engineering. George is not a very good leadership choice for establishing and growing a department.

What can be done about George? Can anything be done about George…? SHOULDN’T something be done about George…?!!

 

[walterbrennan]

Sorry for the Handle change, right there in the middle of the thread, folks... I had started out using a secondary (tipsteronline), because one of our other structural folks was an avid eng-tips.com user, himself; and new my original handle (walterbrennan). However, I've lately brought him up to speed on my (anonymous) broadcast of our predicament, via this thread; so there’s no reason to go on using the alias…

Again, sorry for any confusion…

 

[49078]

This reminds me of a posting by unclesyd in another thread where he said:

"If you find yourself in a hole, the first thing to do is stop diggin."

 

[walterbrennan]

Oh, you folks are a riot, you are...

Well, thanks all, for the bucketload of advice. My job hunt recently expanded from (just) the outfit across town all the way back to my home state. Depending on what I find, George may just have to go it without my sorry company.

Ironically, our other, junior engineer has joked that if I don't take that job across town (he only knows about that one), then maybe I should at least introduce HIM to them. If he knew I was looking OUTSIDE of town also, that probably wouldn't come off so much as a joke...! And, the guy across town has already got his eye on drafer A; point-blank asking if I could convince them to defect with me... the funniest part is, they probably would.

I wonder if upper management will take a different view when their structural "department" shrinks back to just George and drafter B... or, maybe they'll just sit around blamin' ol' walterbrennan...?

Not that I'd ever need to sabotage things, that way; George has (unwittingly) done a jim-dandy job of that already, himself. Nope, I won't bother interfering. For these poor, dumb bastards it's not WHETHER they're going to go; it's just WHEN and to WHERE...

I'll sign back onto this thread, one last time, when my end of things is all said and done; just for anyone who is morbidly curious. After that you may conduct your own post-mortem. I hope to get my licks in going out the door, but to not burn the really important bridges. But whatever else, I do plan to go. There HAVE to be better situations, somewhere; and I've gained all the gray I'm going to over George...

 

[Ashereng]

walterbrennan,

Frustration leads us all to do things. I am glad that you have decided on a path forward.

WRT getting "your licks in going out the door", I would advise to let it go. Think about what you are going to do, and what the likelyhood of the results are going to be.

Chances are, it would only make you feel better for an hour.

Chances are, it could make your life more difficult down the road, in ways you can not foresee now.

You have a path, take it. Leave the damaged baggage behind.

Just my 2 cents worth. Good Luck.

 

[ewh]

I have been following this with interest and wish you good luck on your decision. Please keep us updated.

 

[RDK]

I’d have to vote with ashereng on this one.

NEVER BURN BRIDGES IF YOU CAN HELP IT.

There is never any benefit to it other than feeling better for an hour or so and always a downside that will arise in ways that you cannot foresee now. It may even hurt you without your knowing it. (What is 10 years from now, George is working for another company and throws your resume in the garbage?)

Walk out the door with your head held high and your professionalism intact, because after all living well is the best revenge.


Rick Kitson MBA P.Eng

Construction Project Management
From conception to completion

http://www.kitsonengineering.com

 

[Ashereng]

I’d have to vote with ashereng on this one.

Almost fell off of my chair.

 

[walterbrennan]

Well, the deed is done. I just thought I’d update everyone on how things ended up; probably the last of my postings to this thread.

It was Tuesday Morning. I dropped the letter on George’s desk, as I settled into the chair across from him. It was short; just three paragraphs long. It stated rather simply my intention to voluntarily terminate my employment, my offer to stay on as necessary through a certain date (in order to transition my concern in ongoing projects), and so on and so forth.

I tell ya, the guy had hardly begun to read it when he almost wiped his brow and exhaled in relief. Then, almost as quickly his expression changed, and he launched into the obligatory, “…well, I didn’t expect this…” and “… you know, I wasn’t trying to run you off, or anything…” and the like. I’ve never been through such an anticlimactic affair in my entire professional career. It was like talking about the weather…! He never even ventured to ask why; just accepted it without much comment.

I also copied my department cohorts; although all but one of them saw it coming, based on previous conversations. Finally, I stopped in and dropped a copy on the office manager’s chair. As I was actively engaged in projects with some of the other departments, I sent around a brief email to the same effect to the department heads in our office. And that, as they say, was that.

Throughout the course of the day no fewer than four department heads (my own not among them, of course) sat down across my desk from me; each wanting to know why; why was I (seemingly) suddenly up and leaving…? Their genuine concern, coupled with the fact that I wasn’t even IN any of their departments, made it all that much more baffling: the fact that by the close of business that day the office manager hadn’t even said a word to me. Maybe I’m just WAY too low on the pole to understand it, but if I were the office manager, and the guy immediately below the manager of one of my departments just dropped a letter on my chair tendering his notice, I might pick up the telephone; or even just toddle on over, and try to find out why…?!

A couple of the department managers that came by to visit posed the radical hypothetical that, what if I was just handed the reins in structural; would that have kept me on…? It was surreal to even hear it spoken out loud. And, coming from people at their level, it was kind of a kick in the ass. And, it certainly explained George’s state of mind; or, at least his reaction, upon my resignation. If two of his fellow department managers were willing to throw that out there, even fancifully, out loud… well, it’s not hard to imagine that it had run through George’s mind a time or two, lately.

The other structural feller in our department (Junior) lamented, and probably rightly so, that George’s “relief” wouldn’t last much more than a couple of weeks. For the first time in about eight months, we’ve finally got a couple of decent sized projects coming in. They’re not anything that I’d personally get too excited about, size- and type-wise; I’ve been there too many times before. But they’ll be breakout projects, for Junior; assuming they give him the good drafter and just turn him loose on one. Watching him develop, being a sounding board for him, I think he’s ready to turn that corner. George, though… well, given his strip mall and multi-family background, George AIN’T gonna be up to these types of jobs, himself… at least not for the size budgets he’s gonna have at his disposal. I’ve seen it over and over, since I’ve been here; too much wheel-reinventing going on, in his office. He just doesn’t have the background to make money on the kind of jobs we’ve been getting.

Anyway, over the next few days, I began to let some others know, and of course by the end of the week there was no need to announce it further. I got some very positive feedback from a couple of clients; which is always encouraging. With others, I just hadn’t been around town long enough to get to know them, much better than tangentially, through some brief project interaction. But, nearly all of them were at least courteous enough to reply; if only as a matter of decorum.

And, so, in a few short weeks, I will close this chapter on my professional career; even as I begin anew. Having in hand an offer from a nearby (former) colleague to come join his outfit, I felt it best to consider all viable options; rather than just jump ship to the OTHER outfit. So, with the wife’s consent, I decided to have a look at options closer to where we had called home, years ago before coming to the upper Midwest. I was surprised to learn that there was remarkable demand back in my old home state. Before all was said and done, I had a salary offer that was more than fifty percent higher than my current wages; a substantial amount of money, considering that I am currently paid well above average for this region. Of course the responsibilities are also a step up; but only on paper. The only real change is that I’ll be getting PAID to do all of the things that I’ve been doing here, for George; mentoring juniors, writing proposals, setting budgets, managing projects, and marketing new and existing clients. And of course, you guessed it, there will be NO George. In fact, there will be literally NOBODY between me and the owner, managerially. He just needs somebody to come on up and run the structural side of his company. He’s offered to just move us up; lock, stock and barrel. So, off we go.

I have appreciated all of your input on this matter. I have elected to go along with the overwhelming sentiment that I should just take the high road, and leave without a big fuss. Just like I told those department managers that came asking, it’s George’s shot at the big-time; let him give it his best go, without me sabotaging it on my way out. (I don’t consider that my leaving, in itself, is an effort at sabotage. Just looking out for me and mine…) One of them suggested that, during my exit interview, I should, “…remain my candid ol’ self, when talking to H.R.” I think I’m just going to resist that urge; however tempting it might be. That suggestion coming from a department manager, combined with our office manager’s most recent behavior (and his past, which has been every bit leadership by BAD example) only goes to bolster my belief that everyone already KNOWS what’s wrong in that place, management-wise; it’s just that nobody is willing to call “B.S.” around here. And sadly, as some of you have rightly pointed out, my doing so on my way out won’t change that attitude. So, in like a lion, out like a lamb; I suppose.

Anyway, thanks for you input. You’ve all been generous with your time. I will post to this thread again only if anything remarkable occurs between now and the day I leave. I do not expect that anything shall. Feel free, as is the purpose of this contraption, to speak amongst yourselves. Your (collective) analysis is always appreciated.

Good luck, and God Bless.

walterbrennan

 

[jmw]

Congratulations.
You now start fresh at a new company with a clean sheet and I would suggest that you keep number one at the top of the list in the survival stakes.
You can never avoid office politics but play the game for no.1, keep it purely defensive and minimal.

The message for us all is: Don't be drawn into someone else's office politics.

That's exactly what seems to have been going on here; George isn't the real problem, he is a symptom of a problem higher up the tree and you've been exploited quite cynically by the others for their own ends no matter how genuine your own concerns were. That makes it impossible that your concerns would ever have been objectively considered. If it all blew up do you think these guys would be there rooting for you? No way, they'd look after number one.

"what if I was just handed the reins in structural; would that have kept me on…?

is too late and, coupled with this other comment:

One of them suggested that, during my exit interview, I should, “…remain my candid ol’ self, when talking to H.R.”

suggests that this is a palce revolt and you were a stalking horse, an expendable asset in their tool box.

They tried to use you for their own ends, they did'nt really care about you except as a means to leverage George out and you were a win/win solution for them whether you stayed or you left.

Leaving a job it is vital to go cleanly and without burning bridges, without rancour and without, however tempting, "letting them exactly why" it does no good, that's why you're going.

Who knows what the future will bring?

You now have zero concern with this company and anyone who works there. Let them get on with their problems. It doesn't matter if George gets to be MD or goes out on his ear. Not now.

If that HR meeting is still pending, resist playing their game, if anything, downplay the George problem entirely and put it all down to a need for pastures new. Don't leave ammunition around for anyone to use, not in writing or emails and keep it ultra-professional.

Good luck at your new job.



JMW

http://www.ViscoAnalyser.com

 

[jmw]

PS purely out of curiosity, why is George so difficult a target for the management assasins?
Did he marry the Boss's daughter?
If not, there'll be blood soon and maybe not all George's.

JMW

http://www.ViscoAnalyser.com

 

[Ashereng]

walterbrennan,

Good luck at your next career stop.

It takes a lot of will power to stay professional in the exit interview. You need to answer the questions honestly, while staying professional and neutral (especially with the non-verbal part of the conversation). Good on ya!

 

[MikeHalloran]

There is no upside to answering exit interview questions _at_all_.

If you can't avoid the interview entirely, limit your answers to extremely brief statements of irrefutable fact.



Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA

 

[Zoomzoo]

Actually, more likely than not, George was not the problem - but a symptom of a deep problem. I had a George once (but his name was Bill).

Congrats on leaving - that's what I did, and I never looked back (and I gave the most nebulous glossy answers to the HR during the exit interview).

Zoom

 

[Xofa]

I'm question the benefit of keeping constructive criticism to yourself during your exit interview with HR. It is the job of HR to address certain issues within a company (typically more behavior based and less technical) and with no feedback to use there is no ammunition for them to justify a necessary change.

I may be a bit opinionated though because I handed a stack of very factual emails to a persons department manager on my way out the door. The emails detailed how she was not only incompetent but intentionally whited out my signature on the application for my loan to purchase my first home. Let it surfice to say that after wrote the email & the situation became public the company was very accomodating to my situation and very helpful to make sure that everything worked out well for me.

Will those emails make any bit of difference? I know that it makes me feel better that if she tries to pull a stunt like this again she will not get the benefit of the doubt.

Is my behavior unprofessional? In my opinion no. The voice of the customer is important to ensure customer satisfaction. I was very dissatisfied with the service I recieved and made it know. Without this feedback everyone just assumes that everything is OK and no adjustment is necessary.

But back to the thread...

After reading this thread George's decisions may have been financially based. Replace high paid (though very skilled) employees with lower paid (and less skilled) employees. I can also see how drafter B would be fanatically loyal to George since George did save his job (insecure leaders like very loyal people).

The most important part however is that the poster found an excellent position where he can bring his competence to the forefront. I wish you the best of luck in your new position and am sure you will be a great guy to work for.

-John

 

[MikeHalloran]

HR weasels just love factual emails, that give them lots of phrases to quote out of context in order to defame you.



Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA