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work in iraq? 4
- Thread starter Denob
- Start date
uncivilized
Civil/Environmental
How much are they going to pay you? Will it be taxed? What will you be doing? Design or construction? Design work would probably be safer. I would look at what part of Iraq too - some spots are safer than others.
When I got out of the AF a lot of my buddies were taking jobs as US contractors in Saudi, UAE, and Kuwait. It seemed like a good deal back in the mid 80s but with the situation in the middle east.....their is no amount of money that would make me risk my life. Being in Iraq is a good thing if you're a junior officer in the US Army or USMC seeking combat experience to enhance your military career other than that you would be a sitting duck.
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Some things to look at.
Make sure that there is adequate health and disability insurance in place. Does the health insurance include repatriation home by air ambulance if medicinally necessary? Post return medical coverage for latent diseases or long term injury? Deductable?
Take a look at the security arrangements for you and your place of work. Inside armed compound or living on the economy? What about at the job site including travel to and from?
What are the living conditions? Tent, semi permanent construction camp or permanent housing? Single accommodation, shared or group housing?
What is the turn around conditions? How often will you get home and at whose expense? Travel included in time off or does the time start when you leave Iraq?
Can you take your spouse to Europe and meet her there instead of a full trip home?
What expenses are covered by the company and which will you be responsible for yourself?
Will you be covered under SOFA? (Status of Forces Agreement covering military personnel and sometimes extended to civilian contractors.)
Will you be subject to military discipline and justice? (Canadian contractors working in Bosnia were subject to military discipline and code of conduct.)
Recreational opportunities? Is there anything in place or are you expected to work all the time or sit in your room?
Rules on alcohol? (Canadian contractors in Bosnia were only allowed two drinks a day, non accumulative and had to be drunk in the pub same as for CAF personnel.)
Have a good look at the tax situation; taxes can be complex for international work.
Currency of payment. I am assuming USD and that you are an American so it’s not an issue but if not then changes in currency can have a significant impact on total remuneration.
Rick Kitson MBA P.Eng
Construction Project Management
From conception to completion
Make sure that there is adequate health and disability insurance in place. Does the health insurance include repatriation home by air ambulance if medicinally necessary? Post return medical coverage for latent diseases or long term injury? Deductable?
Take a look at the security arrangements for you and your place of work. Inside armed compound or living on the economy? What about at the job site including travel to and from?
What are the living conditions? Tent, semi permanent construction camp or permanent housing? Single accommodation, shared or group housing?
What is the turn around conditions? How often will you get home and at whose expense? Travel included in time off or does the time start when you leave Iraq?
Can you take your spouse to Europe and meet her there instead of a full trip home?
What expenses are covered by the company and which will you be responsible for yourself?
Will you be covered under SOFA? (Status of Forces Agreement covering military personnel and sometimes extended to civilian contractors.)
Will you be subject to military discipline and justice? (Canadian contractors working in Bosnia were subject to military discipline and code of conduct.)
Recreational opportunities? Is there anything in place or are you expected to work all the time or sit in your room?
Rules on alcohol? (Canadian contractors in Bosnia were only allowed two drinks a day, non accumulative and had to be drunk in the pub same as for CAF personnel.)
Have a good look at the tax situation; taxes can be complex for international work.
Currency of payment. I am assuming USD and that you are an American so it’s not an issue but if not then changes in currency can have a significant impact on total remuneration.
Rick Kitson MBA P.Eng
Construction Project Management
From conception to completion
It would be dangerous, no doubt. However, the pay is very (or should be) substantial. When I worked in the oil patch, I had an opportunity to do international field service and there was always an adder to your base pay for hazard duty. I talked to some people who did this and it was quite scary. Some of the locations required armed guards met you at your plane on landing. They went with you on the helicopter journey to the site and remained there the whole time (at least the whole time YOU were there) and escorted you back.
I would not even think about doing for less than $120k, non-exempt. Contractors are targets over there so I would definately be asking a lot of questions. RDK gave you a good list of some of the important questions.
I would not even think about doing for less than $120k, non-exempt. Contractors are targets over there so I would definately be asking a lot of questions. RDK gave you a good list of some of the important questions.
120k?? if you mean per year, you can stay in the US and get that. I understand that even common or garden security guards are being paid $100/hr. With reasonable OT that translates into more than $250,000.
One other point of information about the tax free status. It's only applicable on a certain amount of your compensation. When I availed of it a few years ago it was the first $80k, I think. After that, you do pay taxes. You also have to be out of the country for more than 330 days.
This all assumes that you are a US taxpayer, of course.
One other point of information about the tax free status. It's only applicable on a certain amount of your compensation. When I availed of it a few years ago it was the first $80k, I think. After that, you do pay taxes. You also have to be out of the country for more than 330 days.
This all assumes that you are a US taxpayer, of course.
DaveVikingPE
Structural
"120k?? if you mean per year, you can stay in the US and get that"
as a rank-and-file engineer? Where?! Please tell me. Seriously.
OK, sarcasm off... $120k a year can be made in the US, definitely, probably at the senior PM level, though or higher. Or you could change fields.
Now, if you want some AMAZING experience. If you want to SEE WITH YOUR OWN EYES what's going on over there. If you want to work as a (albeit well-paid) serf of the US Army Corps of Engineers. If you want to MAKE THINGS WORK. If you want to get ten years' (or more) design-build-fix, estimating including award and rip-off, experience in a single year. If you can deal with the FRUSTRATION of doing the BARE MINIMUM TO SATISFY A VAGUE SCOPE OF WORK THAT YOUR SUPERIORS SPEND LESS TIME INTERPRETING THAN THEY DO DECIDING WHAT TO HAVE FOR LUNCH IN THE DINING FACILITY. If you want the CHALLENGE of working with people whose mother tongue is different than yours - and you will come back with some of their language(s). THEN DO IT!
The work that's going on in Iraq is important. The more smart people (e.g., people on eng-tips) who take part in it, the better.
There is much danger, yet where there is danger there is reward. Take lots of pictures, write a diary, come back and tell what you saw. And if you didn't drop it, don't pick it up.
as a rank-and-file engineer? Where?! Please tell me. Seriously.
OK, sarcasm off... $120k a year can be made in the US, definitely, probably at the senior PM level, though or higher. Or you could change fields.
Now, if you want some AMAZING experience. If you want to SEE WITH YOUR OWN EYES what's going on over there. If you want to work as a (albeit well-paid) serf of the US Army Corps of Engineers. If you want to MAKE THINGS WORK. If you want to get ten years' (or more) design-build-fix, estimating including award and rip-off, experience in a single year. If you can deal with the FRUSTRATION of doing the BARE MINIMUM TO SATISFY A VAGUE SCOPE OF WORK THAT YOUR SUPERIORS SPEND LESS TIME INTERPRETING THAN THEY DO DECIDING WHAT TO HAVE FOR LUNCH IN THE DINING FACILITY. If you want the CHALLENGE of working with people whose mother tongue is different than yours - and you will come back with some of their language(s). THEN DO IT!
The work that's going on in Iraq is important. The more smart people (e.g., people on eng-tips) who take part in it, the better.
There is much danger, yet where there is danger there is reward. Take lots of pictures, write a diary, come back and tell what you saw. And if you didn't drop it, don't pick it up.
Another suggestion for foreign work, don’t take anything that you would not hesitate to leave behind in an instant.
If you must take anything of great value or sentimental value keep it on you (along with your passport) at all times.
That way if you have to bug out you will not miss the last chopper because you went back for some pictures.
Rick Kitson MBA P.Eng
Construction Project Management
From conception to completion
If you must take anything of great value or sentimental value keep it on you (along with your passport) at all times.
That way if you have to bug out you will not miss the last chopper because you went back for some pictures.
Rick Kitson MBA P.Eng
Construction Project Management
From conception to completion
GregLocock
Automotive
daveViking according to salary.com a 75%ile Design Engineer IV would be on 112k, in sunny old Ann Arbor. Admittedly, now wouldn't be the perfect time to look for a job in the auto industry, and it isn't quite 120k.
Cheers
Greg Locock
Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.
Cheers
Greg Locock
Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.
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- #12
Buzzp
Sounds like you were being sarcastic. If not, my apologies.
Here's an exerpt from the PBS website for Frontline [regarding security guards in Iraq]
"private security guard at Erinys makes approximately $400 dollars a day, twice what a soldier makes. Some guards make up to $1000 a day"
On salary possiblities in the US, I am looking out my office window right now in a Midwest State and I could throw a stone and hit 3 engineer's under 30 making $125,000+. Yes you do have to put your life on hold, work lots of hours and travel (Just like you do if you go to Iraq). Unfortuately for the OP it's normally electrical/mechanical types that make this kind of money.
PS I didn't throw the stone (too expensive)
Sounds like you were being sarcastic. If not, my apologies.
Here's an exerpt from the PBS website for Frontline [regarding security guards in Iraq]
"private security guard at Erinys makes approximately $400 dollars a day, twice what a soldier makes. Some guards make up to $1000 a day"
On salary possiblities in the US, I am looking out my office window right now in a Midwest State and I could throw a stone and hit 3 engineer's under 30 making $125,000+. Yes you do have to put your life on hold, work lots of hours and travel (Just like you do if you go to Iraq). Unfortuately for the OP it's normally electrical/mechanical types that make this kind of money.
PS I didn't throw the stone (too expensive)
Just to underline my previous post
"Security guards in Iraq make up to $33,000 a month "
Source - World Tribune.com
"Security guards in Iraq make up to $33,000 a month "
Source - World Tribune.com
Hemibuell,
The word "lie" is a very strong statement. If you were talking to me face to face I am pretty sure you would use your words more judiciously.
However, since you are clearly bitter about your salary I will help you improve your situation by answering your question.
Many engineers who are working for a major OEM of Gas or steam turbines, performing startup through out the world or even in the US only will make at least $125k. This is because working 80 hours + /week is not unusual. Engineers in this situation often get paid salary plus OT. Many engineers get compensated 1 1/2 or even double time. This is not even including perdiem and other bonuses. The same can be said, I think, for petrochem start up and such.
I'm not younger than 30 but I wouldnt even consider to do what I am doing for less than $125k.
I am sure that there are many engineers belonging to Eng-tips that travel and are on emergency call that can confirm this.
The word "lie" is a very strong statement. If you were talking to me face to face I am pretty sure you would use your words more judiciously.
However, since you are clearly bitter about your salary I will help you improve your situation by answering your question.
Many engineers who are working for a major OEM of Gas or steam turbines, performing startup through out the world or even in the US only will make at least $125k. This is because working 80 hours + /week is not unusual. Engineers in this situation often get paid salary plus OT. Many engineers get compensated 1 1/2 or even double time. This is not even including perdiem and other bonuses. The same can be said, I think, for petrochem start up and such.
I'm not younger than 30 but I wouldnt even consider to do what I am doing for less than $125k.
I am sure that there are many engineers belonging to Eng-tips that travel and are on emergency call that can confirm this.
My comments about salary is base salary. Yes you can make a lot more with overtime. I used to work in the oil patch and I worked a minimum of 80 hrs a week. One week I had 114 hrs which left ~6hrs a day to sleep, shower, and spend one minute with the family. So yes you can make that kind of money but when you don't have a life to spend it, it does not make much difference.
agreed, Buzz, and yes it is tough, that's why people don't do it for long. But the fact still remains that the possibility is still there. I don't have a problem with people (hemi) being sceptical, that's human nature but to be called a liar is tough to swallow. Thanks for verifying that this kind of money can be made in the US in engineering if you are willing to put your life on hold, as I stated previously.
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The first place I worked for had a similar setup, the engineers were paid base plus overtime. They must have made close to if not over $100K cdn. I realised that wasn't for me when one of the guys I worked with nearly missed his wedding b/c he was working....me nearly missing the birthday party my then girlfriend (now wife), had planned for over 4 months also helped to swerve my opinion away from that sort of work.
I personally live by the motto that you spend time to make money but you can't spend money to buy time.
I personally live by the motto that you spend time to make money but you can't spend money to buy time.
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