A negative unprofessional coworker 16

[EngineerDave]

I am concerned about a co-worker who is negative and unprofessional towards me. I believe the issue started about 2 months ago and is related to an after work happy hour discussion. This guy always talks about politics whether in work or out and I happen to disagree with him.

I took him and another coworker on in a spirited debate (once again outside of work in a pub).

Since then it's been the cold war. Now I am more worried because I will be moving into the same office he works in.

When I ask him for assistance on things, he completely blows me off. He will go out of his way however to help the young attractive women that work in that office. He will talk with them for hours and joke with them, half the time I see him he is either joking with them or helping them with their work.

I think this is totally unprofessional. He doesn't even acknowledge me when I say hi.

Now I'm moving into an office feet from him. I will continue to say hello in the morning, but I won't let take any crap from him.

I work too hard to put up with this emotionally charged basketcase. I have never seen anything like it in any of my jobs. I don't expect that we have to be friends, but he should be professional at work.

I spoke with other coworkers about him and they said there are people in the department that he hasn't spoken a word to in years because of an argument.

 

[EngineerDave]

Well redgdon, I'm in a new town, in a new job and a new career. And regrettably my social circle is small but slowly expanding. This is in part due to the difficulty in moving to a new town, but also suffered a bit of a heartbreak (my girlfriend decided she wouldn't move here and broke up with me, still love that girl and we never fought, but what can you do?)

 

[ziggi]

Too bad adult problems can't solved in the same way that children's problems are solved, ie. a beat down. It's less stressful and way more efficient, bloody lawyers and their assault charges Plus every childhood fight I've ever witnessed has led to the creation of a great friendship, I think it's due to mutual respect.

Barring you don a ski mask and corner the schmuck in a dark alleyway. I would suggest investing in a voice recorder and documenting his behaviour. Then show the evidence to your boss, NEVER EVER show it to the schmuck before showing it to your boss though. Oh and make sure that the person speaking in the voice recorder can be clearly identified.

Sounds somewhat sinister, but I'm a firm believer in quickly and efficiently removing cancers.

 

[jmw]

This is one of the things that HR are supposed to monitor....
That said, document and save but don't be the instigator; it's surprising hw often these jerks are favoured by management for no rational reason just as it is surprising how often non-professional behaviour is tolerated by management when logically you would expect otherwise.
His refusal to co-operate will impact on your own work and guess whose work will be reviewed in a "situation".
Management usually react to problems by associating the messenger with the problem i.e. if your raise the issue it is you who will be considered the problem maker.
Long term you can hope this guy will do enough damage to himself that he will ultimately get sacked... however, i wouldn't bet on it.. keeping your CV current seems a good bet and you don't want any "problems" with a reference.

PS this is probably the one time that those "team building" events can be useful.... not for team building but just to expend your entire arsenal of paint balls on your favourite target (see Icebreakers: thread731-131323 ) and note who else does the same!

JMW

http://www.ViscoAnalyser.com

 

[EngineerDave]

This is freaking incredible. Twice today I have passed him and in situations where normal mentally healthy people would say hi, he didn't say a word. It is like he took a Buddhist vow of silence against me. For the record I said hi both times.

If it weren't for what he might say to turn my coworkers against me this would be a total laugh. The guy has serious serious issues. I said hi to him both times. The guy looks like a deer in the headlights when he looks at me.

It will be real interesting when I move into the same office area here soon. That is what I'm not looking forward too and it's only because of him.

 

[bigTomHanks]

Dave

I've had coworkers treat me this way and we were on good terms. Some people are just plain weird at work and I really wouldn't let it bother you. Those mostly wrong personality stereotypes that engineers have are because some engineers actually perfer to have horrible interpersonal skills.

bigTomHanks

 

[HgTX]

"I would suggest investing in a voice recorder and documenting his behaviour"

Someone remind me--this isn't illegal (in the US) as long as ONE of the parties to the converation is aware of the recording, right?

Just making sure.

Hg

Eng-Tips policies: faq731-376

 

[ziggi]

I'm not really sure, I think that it is inadmissible in court, but if you're proving a point to your boss.
Or you can just display it in plain sight and turn it on in an animated manner in front of the person. I believe that a court would count that as making the person aware. I don't really know for sure, those lawyers are tricky at best.

 

[wes616]

Hg,

This is a state to state issue. Some states require both parties to be aware of this (Like California) some do not (think Monica, Linda Tripp). Also, if it a telephone conversation that is interstate, both parites must be made aware of the recording. That is why when you call an 800 line, you get the message that "this call may be recorded for training purposes"...

Wes C.

 

[EngineerDave]

Well recording him with regards to me would pick up nothing as he says nothing to me. But I could pick up all the joking and potential harassment he does of the young women that work there.

One thing is for sure, this will surely inspire me to focus on working the entire time I'm at work and even less likely to BS with anyone. If anything else I can show him up that way. I like showing people how professional I am, but hate playing the part of the stoic at work.

 

[ziggi]

EngDave, that's an excellent idea. If you anonymously speak to your boss about his behaviour towards the women in the office. The person is discredited in your bosses' mind, you might be better off having a private conversation with one of the women he harasses and get her to solidify the unsavoury image your boss will have of this lout.
The point is that by doing this you distance yourself from the real problem and your complaint looks more genuine.
Needless to say if all goes well the lout will be going to sensitivity training or worse

 

[jmw]

Ziggi,
the danger is that unless the affected women co-workers have complained of harrasment, a complaint from a new arrival in that work area will send all the wrong signals.

Management aren't the brightest lights on the tree and they will see this as a problem they didn't want to know about being raised by someone who is not affected by the harrasment; who has just joined that work area and who obviously has other motives: i.e. a troublemaker.

Management hate problems and they hate people who bring them problems. Worst of all they hate the problems that could land them in court defending themselves against all sorts of human rights violations.
It is a sad fact that whistle blowers only ever get the satisfaction of having done the right thing because no one else will. Its the same thing with complaints.

Be prepared for if the s*** hits the fan and even be prepared that Mr Unprofessional may steal a march and make a pre-emptive claim whether justified or not.

Actually, and ideally (but in extreme circumstances), try and figure out how to make him do just this, make it his problem and let him make himself a problem to the management.

Let him go to them with a complaint (real or imaginary) and then act all innocent when management make their enquiries... "Mr UP said that? I can't understand it, we always have been most cordial and polite...etc" Now let him explain to management that that just isn't true, he's cut you dead every time you spoke to him.

Of course, if he is a nuisance to every one else and especially the women, just say "Ask anyone in that area, ask Sally for example, she'll confirm it." While "Sally" may not be prepared to go to management with harrasment complaints, when invited by the management to comment on Mr Unprofessional's conduct, you can bet Sally won't let the opportunity pass.

First though, try and catch him sitting at his desk, trap him there (make sure witnesses are around), say "Hi! how's it going today? what did you think about that game last night?" and then wait there in expectant silence. Don't say anything more.

This might just break him down.
It's easy for him to cut you dead passing in the corridor or whatever, but if he is to cut you now he has to stand up, manouver round you and exit as gracefully as he can. Then he has to wait for you to go away from his desk (don't, engage in some mundane unrelated discussion with someone at the next desk or something.)
ALternatively you're going to precipitate a "groundhog event" that will draw HR like flys and you'll have plenty of witnesses that he "just lost it".

Anyway, this isn't about fair, or about right: the world is not a fair place and the workplace is even less so. Its about the survival of number one and you shouldn't forget it. You might also adopt the view that if this his game you might aswell enjoy it.

PS I am indebted to another forum member for the definition of a "grounhog event": a happening in open plan offices, with or without low level partitions, so extreme that everyone pops their heads over the partitions to see what's going on.

JMW

http://www.ViscoAnalyser.com

 

[GregLocock]

I think the above post borders on harassment.

If somebody I didn't like wandered over to my desk and started asking me about the game last night while I was thinking about something they'd probably get a very anglo saxon response at best. And if they complained to my manager he'd say, well then, just leave him alone.

And all this james bond stuff leaves me pretty cold as well.

Just ignore him. It's what you were told as a child, and it is still valid. If the women don't like the way he treats them they have plenty of opportunity to sort it out themselves.





Cheers

Greg Locock

Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.

 

[EngineerDave]

Actually at this point the girls love him. The reason is he coddles them, shows them all the tricks of the trade.

Without giving all the details up, two of the girls who adore him did not go to school for the field we are in. They are getting a free paid education from this guy.

Makes us who have went through the masters program required for this field sick in a way. They need him. So i think they will put up with him.

It is a long story. But believe me I am very upset. He is a total jerk.

 

[HVAC68]

Just ignore him and keep doing your job. You need to be worried only if you have a working interface with him. If you are in parallel paths work-wise, just ignore him and treat him as a non-entity.

As said in my earlier post, I am managing a similar situation for the past 11 months - in fact, I have occasional official interaction due to some overlap in our working needs. I put everything in an e-mail, mark a copy to our common boss, give him a deadline depending on when I am supposed to submit to my client and there ends the matter. If he delays or does not provide information, I send him a polite reminder and he is left with no choice but to answer me. Otherwise, we would have probably greeted each other maybe once in a month or so !!! I even tried sending him a birthday card to help things, but he didn't even bother to reply nor say a thank you !!!

Dave - My suggestion is to just ignore him and concentrate on your work. More importantly, don't lose your cool.

HVAC68

 

[BJC]

You should concentrate on being the best engineer in the place. It will serve you best there and the next place as well. And only worry about things you can do something about ( which is nothing ).

 

[MikeHalloran]

The deer in the headlights behavior in the hallway suggests that he may have already taken some action that he knows will not please you when you find out what it is.

I hope I'm wrong about this: I think you're doomed.

If you stay, the best thing you can do is interact with him as little as possible, as professionally as possible. That may not be enough to save your job.

It's not worth saving. You're stressed now, and proximity is going to make that worse. You haven't been able to change him, and management has absolutely no interest in doing so.

Any groundhog events (I love that phrase too), no matter the proximate cause, will bring down a turdstorm on you. It sounds like no one, certainly not the females, would testify on your behalf, even if HR bothered to conduct a kangaroo court. They won't. In corporate America, there is no due process.

1. GET ANOTHER JOB. ASAP.
2. GET OUT.



Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA

 

[quark]

Mike, get the star for the two excellent posts.

Dave,

I feel your joy about joining the same office to trouble the guy seems to be superficial and it is like masking your disgust. Further, that guy seems to be indifferent to this issue by not even caring to reply you. He can behave in that way when he knows that he has complete advantage over you. Your idea of recording his every day proceedings can be suicidal(this shows no difference between you and the guy about wasting your office time).

If I am in your position, I would try elsewhere. If I am compelled to be in my present job, then I would

1. Interact with that fellow as minimum possible.
2. Never say a word against him to any other soul.
3. Never be in his near vicinity.
4. First try to play with my own ego.

 

[ziggi]

While I agree that you are taking a certain risk by confronting this person, and should probably just ignore him.
It seems to me that a defensive or even apathetic stance will create more trouble b/c whatever he is saying against EngDave behind his back (the deer in the headlights look) could eventually screw EngDave over unless EngDave covers himself somehow or weakens his opponent's credibility (which appears to be what this person is doing to EngDave).
Someone once said that the best defense is a good offense.

 

[EngineerDave]

Well I will not mention him to anyone anymore as it could just create more conflict. He is acting weird.

In terms of job title he is one step below, but he has been there many years and I could learn alot from him, if he would somehow let me.

I like this job and get along well with most of the other people. I also know my work ethic will time and time again prove to be the top in the department. What I don't know in terms of technical skills will come with time.

Without going into great detail about what I do, I'm in a new job in a new career and a new town. It is a technical job that is completely different than the engineering field i studied in undergrad and my first masters degree (but it is what I studied in my recent second masters degree). I am in a period of great learning. It is a shame that one guy refuses to help or be civil.

So leaving the job isn't an option.

 

[EngineerDave]

To add to my last post, I do understand the sentiment. Especially if this guy has polluted the water about me.

But that is what the next few weeks will be about. People with a superior work ethic always trumps the unprofessional ego driven prima donna in the work place (well almost always, but thats a whole different story)