Another drone takes down another helicopter 12

[Sparweb]

Not the first time.
In its report, the NTSB noted that it has now completed three investigations where a collision with a drone has been confirmed, and gathered information on two other collisions where the evidence is consistent with a drone strike.

The drone was operating above 400 feet AGL in airspace that did not permit this, and at night when this is not normally permitted either. The type of drone that probably hit the helicopter (based on the damage) is not the kind that would be equipped with proper anti-collision lights that would make night flight possible.

Here is another example, probably not in the NTSB count - although a much more avoidable one that should not have happened.

http://www.sparweb.ca

 

[MacGyverS2000]

What does registration do? For a car it's to grab cash.

If by "grab cash" you mean provide supplemental funding for a state's infrastructure to help deal with keeping track of the registration, upkeep of the roads they drive on, etc., then sure, it's a money grab.

Of course, if you meant "just another source of random income for the state", then I think you miss the point entirely.

Dan - Owner

http://www.Hi-TecDesigns.com

 

Taxation is the price we pay for civilization.

"Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, but they are not entitled to their own facts."

 

[Alistair_Heaton]

Its going to cost a colossal amount to have any sort of control over 1.6 million drones.

There is no way the current Air traffic infrastructure can hope to process all the info coming from even a small fraction of 1.6 million drones. It will take an utterly colossal IT infrastructure.

I think there is somewhere in the region of 600 000 licensed pilots of aircraft in the USA and if there are already 160k drone pilots that a major addition to the licensing department.

ADS-B doesn't even have a drone data flag to specify the type. And any changes to ADS-B have to be agreed internationally along with any changes to the rules of Class G airspace.

 

[waross]

Why Canadians resist registration:
Handguns were required to be registered in Canada since 1934.
In the early 70s there was a push by the Canadian Government to publicize the requirement and to have all previously unregistered handguns registered.
This was back when many Canadians trusted the government and were basically obedient to the government.
A lot of handgun owners who had been unaware of the legislation came forward and registered their handguns.
Compliance was good among law abiding citizens. Not so good in the criminal sector.
A few years later, a number of classes of registered handguns were reclassified as "Prohibited" and owners were instructed to surrender their prohibited handguns.
Strongly implied was:
"We know who you are and we know where you live."
This may have been the start of the decline of respect for the government in Canada.
If not the start, it was certainly a strong negative force.
In the early 90s a bill was passed that required all firearms including hunting rifles to be registered.
There was widespread opposition and non compliance.
Many gun owners remembered the events of the 70s and feared that this was the first step in disarming Canadians.
Many gun owners refused to comply.
There was an underground market for "Never registered" rifles.
The registry was finally abandoned and the records were destroyed.
While many of those who remember the events of the 70s have forgotten the details, the mistrust/distrust of the government remains and even if the specifics have been forgotten, the attitudes become part of the collective memory and are passed on.
Register my drone?
Well then if the government decides that I can no longer have it, "They will know who I am and they will know where I live."
Note: This post is not against the registration of drones.
This is an attempt to explain one possible reason for the resistance to the registration of drones.


[link ]Bill[/url]
--------------------
"Why not the best?"
Jimmy Carter

 

[fel3]

ironic metallurgist: "Taxation is the price we pay for civilization."

This statement wittingly or unwittingly endorses ALL taxation and, by implication, everything these taxes are spent on. In reality, not all taxes are good, fair, just, justified, appropriate, etc. and not everything these taxes are spent on are good, fair, just, justified, appropriate, etc. I would argue that the number of "bad" taxes and "bad spending" is pretty high, maybe even higher than the "good" taxes and "good" spending.

============
"Is it the only lesson of history that mankind is unteachable?"
--Winston S. Churchill

 

I did not say taxation would be fairly applied or that governments behave well.
The race to the bottom after 40 years of corporate-sponsored demonization of all government and taxation have gotten the US to where it is now, a kleptocracy.

"Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, but they are not entitled to their own facts."

 

[IRstuff]

It is only a matter of time before the GOP can finally dismantle Social Security; they've been working particularly diligently at it for 40 yrs or so, by not objecting to deficits, since that makes SS' financial position more precarious, and therefore, more amenable to privatization.

Little do people know that this means their benefits will plummet, like crazy, since the average person's contributions don't come close to feeding their own retirement income.

TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKorP55Aqvg

faq731-376 forum1529 Entire Forum list

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[Alistair_Heaton]

I suspect most of the issues are not with normal people who this will hit the hardest anyway.

Most of shall we say the most risk operations will be done by various public entities who shall we say have a loose interpretation of what they actually have to do.

As 3ddave said the original report will more than likely involve some form of law enforcement entity flying it. They will deem their mission to override any rules the FAA has about max height and also lighting and if they had anything about squirting unsecure information about location. So they would have turned it all off and/or taped over the lights. This isn't just a feature of where it happened. The entities in Europe and rest of the world think the same way.

There is no way the FAA can afford to regulate and develop a secure system which pulls in all operators including Government entities who will use them. Although to be honest now with 1.6 million already out there and the natural aversion to people wanting to pay a sizable sum to be legal on both the the ownership and piloting side of things I suspect it will be an uphill battle to enforce things which is why they are going after the suppliers on the principle that drones will have a limited lifespan.

They will have to charge something. To be honest the current fee numbers look to me that they are definitely not making a profit out of it.

 

[dik]

The distrust was earlier and started with Diefenbaker, and has gotten worse.

Dik

 

[Compositepro]

Distrust of government has been around since government has existed. As people get older they experience more and more disapointed expectations. They think the world is changing, but it is not. In general there has never been a freer and more prosperous time in human history. That does not mean that every thing is perfect. It never will be.

 

(This was back when many Canadians trusted the government and were basically obedient to the government.)

The distrust was earlier and started with Diefenbaker, and has gotten worse.

Not always - 1919.





"Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, but they are not entitled to their own facts."

 

[CWB1]

The race to the bottom after 40 years of corporate-sponsored demonization of all government and taxation have gotten the US to where it is now, a kleptocracy.

Check your definitions. I'd argue 40+ years of corporate-sponsored kleptocracy created a natural demonization of government and taxation, no corporate lobbying needed for that distrust to evolve. A century ago my grandfather paid exactly one tax, the annual farm property tax. As noted in his memoirs in 1985, many folks mistakenly thought he was frugal because he'd lived through the depression. In reality he claimed to be frugal because over his lifetime the taxes and bills multiplied from less than one day's wages to more than a month's. Today I pay city, county, state, and federal tax on my cell phone bill alone.

As 3ddave said the original report will more than likely involve some form of law enforcement entity flying it. They will deem their mission to override any rules the FAA has about max height and also lighting and if they had anything about squirting unsecure information about location. So they would have turned it all off and/or taped over the lights.

Then that operator needs to be reported to the FAA for prosecution. As I have reminded folks many times, civilian law enforcement is still civilian and the only folks with any reasonable exemption from our laws are our military.

 

[Alistair_Heaton]

I suspect that the operator thought that they could do what they want because its in their patch just like they do with multiple other issues where they use the grey areas of legal argument to do what the hell they want.

And lets face it the training and intelligence of said official entities is extremely variable.

When it happened they discovered the FAA runs the air ground to the heavens and the law is pretty clear on this fact. It is a federal offence.

After they lost the drone someone realised this fact and it disappeared and its cost was lost in other budgets. And they didn't say a thing so they couldn't be caught. Which is why the FAA wants to know about every drone in existence and have a method of finding out what it does. Currently they have zero clue. And know fine that if a police force thinks a drone will help them they will use it. And to them if breaking federal FAA rules to get a conviction so be it, because they are the law and the ground is their patch that's acceptable. When it turns out it's not acceptable, they are masters at evidence manipulation so can ensure there is nothing that sticks.

 

[3DDave]

https://flarm.com/technology/traffic-collision-warning/

But that's private industry. Sigh. Multiple mid-airs in USA airspace in the last month.

 

[Alistair_Heaton]

it used ADS-B and its what we use in gliders and light aircraft in Europe.

Its one of the battery powered boxes that I was on about. there are 3 different types I think

There is also a dongle attachment version which you can connect to an ipad which does a more integrated approach keep you clear of controlled airspace and terrain as well.

But the cost per month was horrendous, It was worth it for flying club aircraft flying 6-8 hours a day 30 days a month. But it was stupid amounts for a private owner who only fly's 1-2 hours a month.

 

[Alistair_Heaton]

Found this on the state of play in EASA land.

https://consortiq.com/european-uas-regulation-further-delayed/?

Its just for info it has zero impact on me.

 

[JohnRBaker]

Speaking of drones and the problems they encounter, here's a story where the drone was the victim of a midair 'attack'...

Shoreline mapping drone taken down by bald eagle on Lake Michigan near Escanaba

The brazen eagle vs. EGLE drone onslaught took place near Escanaba on July 21 when EGLE environmental quality analyst and drone pilot, Hunter King, was mapping shoreline erosion.

https://www.abc12.com/2020/08/13/sh...by-bald-eagle-on-lake-michigan-near-escanaba/

John R. Baker, P.E. (ret)
EX-Product 'Evangelist'
Irvine, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

The secret of life is not finding someone to live with
It's finding someone you can't live without

 

[1503-44]

ADS-B for drones and eagles, Canadian geese ... and every bird weighing more than 250gm?

“What I told you was true ... from a certain point of view.” - Obi-Wan Kenobi, "Return of the Jedi"

 

[JohnRBaker]

Another near miss, only this one would have made the above-the-fold headlines for sure:

Air Force One Just Had A Near Miss With A Drone According To Reporter Onboard

The C-32A was descending into Andrews Air Force Base when the incident supposedly took place.

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zo...ss-with-a-drone-according-to-reporter-onboard

John R. Baker, P.E. (ret)
EX-Product 'Evangelist'
Irvine, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

The secret of life is not finding someone to live with
It's finding someone you can't live without

 

[waross]

A drone on AirForce One?
I haven't heard him called that before.

Bill
--------------------
"Why not the best?"
Jimmy Carter