Eng-Tips is the largest engineering community on the Internet
Intelligent Work Forums for Engineering Professionals
Not quite a disaster but interesting 1
- Thread starter Longinthetooth
- Start date
- Status
Might be interesting to see what Arup comes up with for cause of the bolts shearing off and falling.
Those are large bolts! (size of a human arm).
I think there were falling bolts discovered many years ago by a custodian inside the Kemper Arena (I think) and that lead to a major repair/response.
Check out Eng-Tips Forum's Policies here:
faq731-376
Those are large bolts! (size of a human arm).
I think there were falling bolts discovered many years ago by a custodian inside the Kemper Arena (I think) and that lead to a major repair/response.
Check out Eng-Tips Forum's Policies here:
faq731-376
JedClampett
Structural
Kemper Arena was a little worse than that. More like the custodian found the roof on the floor.
Jed - maybe it wasn't the Kemper but I seem to remember a story about a janitor cleaning one day and finding a structural bolt on the floor and reported this. They eventually discovered a flaw in the design of an arena roof and had to replace numerous bolts, etc. Not sure where that was.
Check out Eng-Tips Forum's Policies here:
faq731-376
Check out Eng-Tips Forum's Policies here:
faq731-376
"there is no risk to the structural integrity of the building".
Yup, nothing to see here. [sarcasm]6-inch thick bolts 2 or 3-feet long are inconsequential to any design, and we really didn't need them. The engineer just spec'd them so he could look smart.[/sarcasm]
Yup, nothing to see here. [sarcasm]6-inch thick bolts 2 or 3-feet long are inconsequential to any design, and we really didn't need them. The engineer just spec'd them so he could look smart.[/sarcasm]
-
1
- #6
JAE,
In one of his books, J.E.Gordon mentions a ship's cook who noticed a crack in the floor of his kitchen (galley?). He reported it to the captain, who told him not to worry about it. "Being of scientific bent", the cook started to mark the dates next to the end of the crack as it propagated along the floor. When the ship split in half, the dates turned out to be on the half that stayed afloat. This has provided much knowledge of crack propagation.
No mention of whether the cook survived.
--
JHG
In one of his books, J.E.Gordon mentions a ship's cook who noticed a crack in the floor of his kitchen (galley?). He reported it to the captain, who told him not to worry about it. "Being of scientific bent", the cook started to mark the dates next to the end of the crack as it propagated along the floor. When the ship split in half, the dates turned out to be on the half that stayed afloat. This has provided much knowledge of crack propagation.
No mention of whether the cook survived.
--
JHG
![[bigears]](/data/assets/smilies/bigears.gif "[bigears] [bigears]")
that this was a 'Liberty Ship' in service in the middle and northern Atlantic routes, and that the cook was on-duty during the breakup, he died. Damn shame, too.- Thread starter
- #9
Longinthetooth
Chemical
Update on this topic
- Thread starter
- #11
Longinthetooth
Chemical
Yes, The usual cop-out. The investigation is probably complete. Now the lawyers will take months to gut the report of anything meaningful.
ornerynorsk
Industrial
The Leadenhall Building !!! That is interesting, wasn't that long ago there was a documentary on the telly praising the modular technique used in its construction. Will be interesting to see what turns up, if it's heat treating, hydrogen embrittlement, or something else. I'd be curious to know the country of origin of those bolts.
It is better to have enough ideas for some of them to be wrong, than to be always right by having no ideas at all.
It is better to have enough ideas for some of them to be wrong, than to be always right by having no ideas at all.
Guest102023
Materials
Drawoh,
That cook probably survived only to be fired.
"If you don't have time to do the job right the first time, when are you going to find time to repair it?"
That cook probably survived only to be fired.
"If you don't have time to do the job right the first time, when are you going to find time to repair it?"
- Thread starter
- #15
Longinthetooth
Chemical
Update.
I have never heard of hydrogen embrittlement in a non-process environment, but I not a metalurgist. Anyone got any info. on this?
I have never heard of hydrogen embrittlement in a non-process environment, but I not a metalurgist. Anyone got any info. on this?
Hydrogen embrittlement can be classified into two categories:
IHE typically is process related, and EHE typically is environment related. A recent civil engineering example of EHE is the occurrence of fractured threaded rods for the San Francisco-Oakland Bay Bridge, with information here:
ASTM F2078 [i said:
IHE typically is process related, and EHE typically is environment related. A recent civil engineering example of EHE is the occurrence of fractured threaded rods for the San Francisco-Oakland Bay Bridge, with information here:
ornerynorsk
Industrial
Curious only one bolt from each location. Each connection contains multiple bolts. Back in the late 60's/early 70's, we had batches of SHCS bolts that were popping the heads 1 to 2 days after being torqued into their assemblies. It was inconsistent, with maybe 20% exhibiting the failure. I was a student with "zero" technical knowledge at the time, so I don't recall what the outcome of root cause was, but it was isolated to one lot number of hardware. It was just reported this morning that a third bolt has failed. My money is on the hardware metallurgy.
It is better to have enough ideas for some of them to be wrong, than to be always right by having no ideas at all.
It is better to have enough ideas for some of them to be wrong, than to be always right by having no ideas at all.
ornerynorsk
Industrial
After reading further into the article, HE was the factor.
It is better to have enough ideas for some of them to be wrong, than to be always right by having no ideas at all.
My previous quote was from the 2001 edition of ASTM F2078. The 2008 edition made some changes:
environmental hydrogen embrittlement (EHE)—hydrogen embrittlement caused by hydrogen introduced into a steel/metallic alloy from an environmental source coupled with stress either residual or externally applied.
internal hydrogen embrittlement (IHE)—hydrogen embrittlement caused by absorbed atomic hydrogen into the steel/metallic alloy from an industrial hydrogen emitting process coupled with stress, either residual or externally applied.
environmental hydrogen embrittlement (EHE)—hydrogen embrittlement caused by hydrogen introduced into a steel/metallic alloy from an environmental source coupled with stress either residual or externally applied.
internal hydrogen embrittlement (IHE)—hydrogen embrittlement caused by absorbed atomic hydrogen into the steel/metallic alloy from an industrial hydrogen emitting process coupled with stress, either residual or externally applied.
Reminds me of the breaking bolts during the construction of San Francisco's Bay Bridge. If I remember correctly, 3" anchor rods failed.
- Status
Similar threads
- Locked
- News