Did not receive the raise i wanted, now what? 75

[MechEng7777]

Hi All, i've been working as an MEP engineer in NYC for 2 years now. Its my first position related to my career after graduating with a BS. I very recently received my end of the year review and received nothing but praise, my boss thinks i am progressing very well and becoming very independent. But to my surprise, after all that i was presented with just a 4% raise and a 4% bonus. I am fine with the bonus i received but i feel the raise is kind of offensive. I will be going into my 3rd year now and my first raise was more than this. My question is, what should i do? Should i sit my boss down and express why i feel i deserve a better raise and how i can do better for next year? Apply to other jobs and get another offer first? Or should i just continue working hard here and see what happens next year? Its a small private company (~80 heads) so promotions are rare. Also, i have my FE and expect to take my PE in 2 more years.

 

[zdas04]

"What should I do?" How about "grow the hell up"? You got a 6% (or some number greater than 4%) raise last year and this year you are offended by 4%? Offended by someone giving you a raise that is just about twice last year's consumer price index increase so your disposable income increased by about a percent.

So, in your mind, 6% last year, should equate to 8% this year, 10% next year, etc. until in 10 years you are assured of getting a 26% raise? On that schedule if you started at $80k, then in year 20 you would be making $6.3 million a year. Nice work if you can get it, but you can't.

For the rest of your career you will probably see 0-6% annual raises. 4% is in the top half of that range. If you enjoy your work, then the raise is just gravy. If you hate your job and only stay because of the money you are making then you are a whore, and probably an incompetent one at that.

I know this seems very harsh. I don't apologize for that. I have seen too many young Engineers sour their lives by similar analysis to the one you made. You are in complete control of your attitude. If you looked at your 4% raise and 4% bonus as found money, and got on with your life then you would be happy. If you think of an entitlement of a bigger percentage raise every year then you will just be miserable. Stop making yourself unhappy over what is actually a pretty silly matter. The conversation with your boss should have been "cool, can I buy you a beer after work?". "Sit him down and express how you feel"? Give me a break. Whenever an Engineer working for me started telling me about his feelings I started looking for a place to park him on someone else.

David Simpson, PE
MuleShoe Engineering

Law is the common force organized to act as an obstacle of injustice Frédéric Bastiat

 

[dvd]

It does seem that there could be worse bosses....

 

[MechEng7777]

Am i really expecting too much? Honest question, not being sarcastic or anything. I know it shouldn't be about the money and i do enjoy this job but i feel at this rate i will not be going anywhere, financially. With the current housing market in NYC its very hard to strive here with this pay level. Which is why i want to get passed this salary "range", and i feel stuck. I know of a few coworkers that are about 5 years ahead of me and are making close to or at the $100k/yr mark. From what i can see i am working every bit as hard as they are. Which is why this raise bothered me since at this rate i will reach where they're at by the time i am 40 yrs of age atleast. Again like i said, i know its more about whether i enjoy my work rather than how much i am paid (Who would want to work hard and be paid pennies? Relative to cost of living in your area that is) but when i see friends/family in the medical field making twice what i am making, and working less hours it is really demoralizing. And no i will not switch to those fields to make more money since i don't enjoy that line of work. It just worries me because i know the potential of what an engineer can earn, but i don't feel i am on the right track to get there. So i guess what you are all saying is to just take this raise with a grain of salt and keep on truckin?

 

[PEDARRIN2]

If you are chasing a salary for what your friends are making or for the house you want to live in - you will never be satisfied. You will always have friends/acquaintences/coworkers/etc. who seem to be making more than you are. You will always see people that are making more than you are, live in better houses, drive better cars, etc.

Unless you stop competing with everybody else and start competing with yourself (do the best you can, learn as much as you can, etc.) you will never be happy.

Since you work for a small private company, maybe they did not have as good of a year, maybe there was not as much money to pass out raises like they did previously. Maybe there were other employees who worked harder/better than you did.

You've been with your company two years and have received what many would consider good raises. So you really have no basis for what the company policy is. Talk to your boss and ask him/her how raises are determined. Ask him if they are based on merit or just occupying a cube. Ask him some avenues you could do to make your raises better. Some ideas are bringing in more business, making budgets, having fewer mistakes.

Give it a few years and examine your priorities and if you still dont like it, look elsewhere.

Something you might want to consider is comparing salary vs. cost of living. I work in the MEP field in the Midwest USA and if the engineers here got $100K after 8 years, they would be very pleased, even with no raises.

 

[DRWeig]

Yep, that's my thought with one addition -- take the raise, be thankful it's not zero, and keep on truckin'...

Most often, in my experience, an engineer gets a big pay jump only when he or she is jumpin' jobs. One to six percent is the burden of the market.

Best to you,

Goober Dave

Haven't see the forum policies? Do so now: Forum Policies

 

[steellion]

I know of a few coworkers that are about 5 years ahead of me and are making close to or at the $100k/yr mark. From what i can see i am working every bit as hard as they are.

The difference between what an engineer with 7 years' experience and an engineer with 2 years' experience is astronomical. Your value to the company is not how hard you work, it's what you produce. I will join the chorus that you should be grateful, not bitter, over a 4% raise. The economy is getting a little better, but we are not far removed from a time when an entry-level engineer should be grateful to just have a job. If you're having trouble making ends meet in New York, then move out of New York. You could move to a smaller city where you might make 80% of your current salary but at 50% the cost of living, so you would come out ahead.

 

[tygerdawg]

Once again, David has put rounds on target.

Two years into the job, a 4% raise (beats the CPI, which the real value here), a 4% bonus, AND also given in a sucky economy with high unemployment rate, and you're offended? Wow. Gonna be a tough life for you. It seems to me that your boss is trying to keep you with the firm. Hope you learn to recognize it and be a little more appreciative, and that the damage isn't already done. Just wait until mid-career when the salary curve flattens out with raises & bonuses that barely match the CPI.

If your performance was super duper outstanding, you walked on water, turned lead into gold, and saved the company a few billion dollars, then yeah perhaps you may be due more.

The fact of the matter is that choosing engineering as a career is not the path to massive wealth, but a comfortable lifestyle.

TygerDawg
Blue Technik LLC
Virtuoso Robotics Engineering

http://www.bluetechnik.com

 

[Latexman]

Be sure you understand how your company's salary and bonus program work. You would probably be better served to know what you need to consistently produce and what behaviours you need to consistently exihibit to get the next promotion.

Good luck,
Latexman

Technically, the glass is always full - 1/2 air and 1/2 water.

 

[ctopher]

Just do your job the best you can. Be happy you are not on the street.
Ego can slow a career.

Chris
SolidWorks 13
ctopher's home
SolidWorks Legion

 

[1gibson]

"Should i sit my boss down... "

Your word selection is very telling. Maybe you should sit down with your boss and discuss it, but no I wouldn't recommend "sitting your boss down" to explain something as if your boss were a toddler.


If 4% is offensive, I am curious what percentage would have been not offensive, what would have adequate, and what would have made you happy?

 

[IRstuff]

You should be offended only if the company made money and the profits did not equitably go to you, i.e., if everyone else got 10%, for example.

In this environment, one ought to consider themselves lucky to have a job at all and have a pay raise, to boot. No pay cuts, no forced furloughs, those are all positives.

TTFN
faq731-376

Need help writing a question or understanding a reply? forum1529

 

[cvg]

wow!
I just got a 2.2% increase and no bonus, but I was given 5 new projects to work on. I get to keep my health insurance and yippee, now I will be fully utilized. I don't have to sit at home on furlough for the next few months!

 

[ctopher]

You can understand now why products are made in China. In China, you want to complain about a raise, there is someone waiting at the door to replace you.

Chris
SolidWorks 13
ctopher's home
SolidWorks Legion

 

[oldestguy]

Here is a thought. How's come you stopped at the BS? That's hardly a start these days. Your value to the company is just above zero. In the next ten years you will still be learning and being more valuable. My reaction is"gosh that's one spoiled kid". The commentators all appear to have had some years more than you and you should be thankful that they were not harsher. Their comments are from experience and that is valuable advice that many a starting engineer does not get. I'd also thank the managers of this WEB site for making this helpful advice available. I know I could have used the same help when starting.

To finalize my words, if you wish to move faster up the ladder and always be ahead of those with the same "time on the job", put in two years and get a Master's. You won't regret it. It's more fun to be In-charge than to be one of the crew. The Master's will help in that regard.

 

[wroggent]

Btai88, I wouldn't be offended if I got 4%, however I would probably see that as a minimum if I felt like I deserved a raise. Anything less and it's basically like "keep it, I won't even notice the difference." The slave mentality of these "older people" is disgusting. I don't see a reason to grovel for your job. If I ever am on a board, I'm sure I will not be as greedy as these ***holes. All I recommend to you is that you optimize your returns on investment - if they cap your pay, cap your efforts such that you still get the same raise without feeling like you wasted your life.

 

[steellion]

WOW, there's a new leader in the clubhouse for most arrogant, entitled employee. Maybe you two can start a business together. You will quickly see why businesses can't give all their employees 10% raises every year.

 

[MacGyverS2000]

Btai,

Some context, which is probably not evident in the earlier postings...

An "average" raise is in the 1.5-2.5% range. This pretty much covers cost of living (COL) increases and nothing else, but it's still pretty typical. If a company offers you less then COL, then you should be offended. If the company offers you 1% over, that's a typical pat on the back. If they offer you 2-2.5%+ over COL (COL is 1.5% for 2013, give or take), that's a sign they're very happy with your work. Most do not get bonuses, so be very happy you get that... 4% is a respectable bonus.

A caveat is if you were hired at below market rates. If that was the case, then a 4% raise may seem paltry, particularly if it doesn't come close to evening you up with the market. The biggest jumps in salary typically come from moving jobs, so if you are way under market, it may behoove you to consider other options. If you were hired at a fair market value and were making a good salary to begin with, I would consider yourself to be one of the lucky few and enjoy the easy ride... to complain about an above-average raise (and bonus) when already making a decent salary will not endear you to anyone, including your boss (no matter how many heart-to-hearts you have with him) and coworkers (who will label you as spoiled and put a target on your back).

Dan - Owner

http://www.Hi-TecDesigns.com

 

[TheTick]

Why is 4% insulting? Because your imagination made you believe you were worth more? Maybe such an imagination should be working at Disney.

 

[dbooker630]

I work at a large manufacturing company and the typical annual raise is in the 3-5% range if promotion is not involved. And that is assuming the company turned a profit. If a promotion is in order 10% is not uncommon where I work. A few years ago during the worst of the downturn there was a 5% cut for all employees, which was eventually restored when we returned to profitability. I guess I am one of the 'older people' now but believe me ww are only trying to help. I was quite fortunate when I was just out of school to be mentored by the 'older people' of the day.