Miami Beach, Champlain Towers South apartment building collapse, Part 10 79

[SFCharlie]

A continuation of our discussion of this failure. Best to read the other threads first to avoid rehashing things already discussed.
Miami Beach, Champlain Towers South apartment building collapse
Miami Beach, Champlain Towers South apartment building collapse, Part 02
Miami Beach, Champlain Towers South apartment building collapse, Part 03
Miami Beach, Champlain Towers South apartment building collapse, Part 04
Miami Beach, Champlain Towers South apartment building collapse, Part 05
Miami Beach, Champlain Towers South apartment building collapse, Part 06
Miami Beach, Champlain Towers South apartment building collapse, Part 07
Miami Beach, Champlain Towers South apartment building collapse, Part 08
Miami Beach, Champlain Towers South apartment building collapse, Part 09


SF Charlie
Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies

 

[MaudSTL]

Hopefully no jackhammering. Forces would be transmitted down though, especially where they actually did decide to go over columns.

The late Elaine Sabino (1210) was worried about the vibrations caused by the roof work.

“But one resident of a top-floor penthouse warned relatives — before she went missing — that the construction on the roof had caused her unit to vibrate.

“She’d been complaining for the past couple of weeks about the construction on the roof,” Douglas Berdeaux said about his wife’s sister, Elaine Sabino. “She said she was worried that the ceiling was going to collapse on top of her bed.””

WaPo

https://archive.ph/fUIpw

 

[MaudSTL]

My head hurts now.

It’s “need to know” vs. “nice to know.” I avoid headaches by focusing solely on collapse witness statements that help us refine the timeline of pre-collapse events. We already have a credible basic timeline of pre-collapse events, so what’s of interest in new collapse witness videos or interviews are new details that may help us better understand what was perceived to be happening in the building leading up to the collapse, and where in the building it was perceived.

The PH12 guy says he heard and felt the actual collapses…a small crash and then a big crash. That information doesn’t add to our understanding of what caused the building to collapse. No matter how he got out or where his family is, what he said is just a “nice to know” unless he can give us new “need to know” pre-collapse details from PH12.

In contrast, Shamoka Furman was in the lobby before, during, and after the collapse and, slightly later, in the post-collapse garage before it was seriously flooded. So what she has to say in these videos, confusing though it was because she was in a state of trauma, is worth analyzing for new details.

>>>>>Edit: This is a better link to the bodycam video transcription by ABC Audio.

https://digital.abcaudio.com/news/n...hock-minutes-after-surfside-building-collapse

 

[zebraso]

“She said she was worried that the ceiling was going to collapse on top of her bed.”

Jesus H Christ.

 

[zebraso]

unless he can give us new “need to know” pre-collapse details from PH12.

And if he was from "PH12" managed to hear the pre collapse and collapse sounds and navigated the building all the way down he may have some need to know details but he unfortunately did not hang around or feel like talking afterward publicly. He was on the street by what 1:30 at least? Since he flashed a badge I might assume he was interviewed by police. So it's a fact then that he was not identified publicly and made no other public statements? If he was in fact from a neighboring building then his value as a witness is probably less but not zero...depending. Having more witnesses is not generally a bad thing especially if one is potentially a police officer trained in making observations. IMO. More data = better conclusions?

 

[Demented]

@MaudSTL, there were a fee more residents, one which I know survived, that mentioned the same thing. I'll try and dig that name out later once I get home. It's burries in emails.

Precision guess work based on information provided by those of questionable knowledge

 

[BKNJ]

There is only one PH at Eighty Seven Park; that is NOT the owner.

The 12th floor is the Penthouse level at CTS; UPH is the floor above.

I suspect he was from the East or North building... I know the North building had a PH-12, and I would assume the East building did... and he was stretching the definition of "next door" in the heat of the moment.

He didn't seem like a man who had just escaped with his family and lost all his stuff.

BKNJ

 

[TheGreenLama]

... planes ....

I didn't see that coming. This thread has turned into a real clown show. I thought there was going to be a reboot of this stream of consciousness nonsense, but some people just can't help themselves. What next? Termites? I'm beginning to wonder if everyone here are actually engineers.

 

[arbitraria]

Wasn't the entire 12th floor referred to as penthouse-level, the 13th was the super-duper extra-special PH-A or other fancy designator? I've seen the 12th floor units labeled both like the regular units (ex. 1208) and like a penthouse unit (PH-8). It's feasible this guy was on the 12th floor of the uncollapsed portion of the building.

Not sure if this has been posted here or not, but the New York Times has a very elegantly assembled series of diagrams as an exploded axonometric laying out each floor, and listing the occupants and their status.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/06/30/us/miami-building-missing-dead.html?hide-chrome=1

(or

https://archive.ph/pDSGl

)

Daily Mail did one was well, looks like hot garbage compared to the NYT version, also don't think it includes the final three victims.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...s-Champlain-Towers-South-horror-collapse.html

Either one is helpful as far as figuring out who was where and when, at least for the failure area of the structure.

 

[Optical98]

TheGreenLama

"Real clown show" Gaslighting at it's best.

9-11 involved "planes", take a seat.

Several survivors mention "sounds like a jet", and this last guy from PH12 says they fly over often.
I'm not suggesting one flew into the building, but there are many articles regarding the new/changed flight paths that began on April 22, 2021.

We've discussed the vibrations of Jackhammers on the roof, piledriving from 87th Terrace, and indepth tide studies. A building in such deteriorated condition didn't need that much of a push. Every additional factor of "verifiable and sourced information" is worth consideration and evaluation.

Attacks on reason and language could be considered anti-intellectual bluster.

 

[Optical98]

Here's a list of Owners of the PHs

PHA PACIFIC COAST INVEST INC - 8777 COLLINS AVE PH-2 (ALEXANDRE M. SANTOS)?
PH1 MAGGIE A MANRARA TRS - 511 SEVILLA AVE CORAL GABLES, FL 33134
PH2 ALEXANDRE M. SANTOS
PH3 SIMON SEGAL Deceased
PH4 JACQUELINE DECKER

PH10 RICHARD AUGUSTINE TRS
PH11 JOSEPH BLASSER - 1541 BRICKELL AVE #3502 MIAMI, FL 33129
PH12 THEDA AND JOSEPH FIALKOV - 3845 BATHURST ST STE 202 TORONTO ONTARIO M3H 3N2, CANADA 

PH5 MAYRA CRUZ
PH6 JORGE A HERNANDEZ-BUSTAMANTE
PH7 STELLA KONIECPOLSKI
PH8 STELLA KONIECPOLSKI
PH9 ZYR LLC - Miami po bx

I had shown PH12 as likely Rented/Leased/Airbnb and Empty (no one listed as missing or a victim).

 

[Debirlfan]

When he says penthouse 12, I think he may just mean the 12th floor penthouse, as opposed to a specific unit.

 

[Murph 9000]

In the confusion when he says PH12, he may be saying PH 12th floor, rather than unit 12 (which was in the collapse zone). It's possible he was in one of the 5 surviving units on 12, and got out via the stairs and collapsed garage.

 

[Optical98]

Debirlfan and Murph 9000

That's why I listed all of the PH Owners.

 

[Santos81]

…planes…

There was a reason why I suggested you take the time to see what SIDs are actually in use and the number of departures that flew one of these:

VACAY
BNGOS
GLADZ
TWZTR
AARPS

That number is ZERO.

Those new Departure Procedures will not become available until the 22nd of this month at the earliest.

but there are many articles regarding the new/changed flight paths that began on April 22, 2021.

Which makes this a completely false statement.

What began on April 22 was training in order to implement them at a later date.

 

[SFCharlie]

I didn't see that coming.

Thank you for your request for plausibility in our discussions. The activities of Miami-Dade have made credible evidence hard to come by, and (I guess) some of us have become a bit too cynical as a result.


SF Charlie
Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies

 

[mb3928]

“She said she was worried that the ceiling was going to collapse on top of her bed.””

Anyone who has ever hammer-drilled anywhere in a building has received this complaint. It means nothing.

 

[Santos81]

The activities of Miami-Dade have made credible evidence hard to come by, and (I guess) some of us have become a bit too cynical as a result.

What activities and (lack of) credible evidence are you referring to?

 

[SFCharlie]

We've discussed the vibrations of Jackhammers on the roof, piledriving from 87th Terrace,

I suggest that you compare the over pressure of a sonic boom with the pressure applied by a jack hammer to the building that collapsed, or the pressure of a pile driver. Please compare the sound levels allow for aircraft on landing and takeoff with the sound levels of jackhammers and pile drivers. Critical thinking on your part may prevent scoffing on our part. Sonic booms knock out windows, I have not herd of any surrounding building losing windows.

SF Charlie
Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies

 

[SFCharlie]

What activities and (lack of) credible evidence are you referring to?

Miami-Dade have prevented independent drone overflights, limited access to adjacent building. limited press access to a brief visit to the street (demoed) side of the building. They have released mostly close ups of people working on the pile rather than showing us damage to the structure. They have prevented a recognized structural analyst access to the site or the debris pile.
This could be respect for the families of victims whose remain are still in the pile.
This could be that as a party to the NIST investigation, they agreed not to release information.
But preventing the public for seeing what's going on, seem above and beyond...



SF Charlie
Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies

 

[SFCharlie]

Surfside land remains crime scene, but will soon (3 weeks) be in possession of court

SF Charlie
Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies