Need Wood truss engineer for Nevada 23

[jepps3]

Hello. I’m looking for engineered flat roof wood truss design for a single family home in Nevada.

I know truss manufacturers can provide this, but I don’t want them to design. I would like to get the design drawings independently and then send out to manufacture.

 

[Eng16080]

For another crazy idea: What about using bar joists? Obviously mixing different trades/materials isn't great, but perhaps it can make sense here depending on the cost.

 

[Aesur]

We have a few projects going up in Nevada currently and I don't recall seeing anyone complaining about the cost being higher there for wood trusses as compared to our projects in Arizona and California. A few years ago we tried to get the truss design software from both Mitek and Simpson to offer trusses design services to our clients when truss engineering was backlogged 6+ months and both said no, they only offer their software to truss manufacturers. As others have said, we don't have access to the proprietary software and it would cost us money and time to develop spreadsheets or other tools to do these designs and quite honestly, there isn't a market for this other than your project.

You said $27k for the whole package, does this also include installation, or just engineering and trusses?

Listen, of course we are in a sue happy environment. Put it in the agreement that I pay for any lawyer fees/court costs to cover your butt. What more do you want? You’re getting 20k and I’ll wipe your butt for years to come if any crap smears on your cute little butt. I’ll agree to it.

I'm sure we have all heard this before, what happens if your company closes it's doors. Indemnity clauses only take you so far, in the end lawyers are the only ones that come out on top as most insurances settle rather than fight, it's just cheaper that way for them.

I'd be closer to $120k in fees if you wanted to use it to build 50 houses.

I would be similar or more. I could also see this being setup as an upfront larger fee and then a smaller reuse fee for each reuse, however this relies on trust that the developer/contractor will pay you for each reuse. I would also anticipate that an engineer without the proprietary software, would most likely provide a design which is more expensive than the original price from a manufacturer.

 

[RontheRedneck]

The thread is too long to read every post. So I'm just gonna give my perspective on this.

If someone comes in with an engineered drawing for a truss, I'll ignore it and redesign it with our software. The drawing will most likely not have the species and grades of lumber or the brand of plates that we stock, so pre-designing a truss is a waste of time.

The major plate companies (Alpine and Mitek) have engineers with seals in all 50 states. So getting a sealed drawing would not be a problem.

Although a sealed drawing is not really needed unless a local building department requires it. We don't get seals on 90% of the trusses we build.


About the pricing issue - There is no "standard" formula for pricing trusses. Pricing can vary greatly from one manufacturer to another.

It's also possible the OP is not comparing apples to apples. No way to know without reviewing all the details.

 

[jepps3]

@XR250 - Would love to stick frame, but not possible with 1/12 flat roof design spanning 40ft clear.

@eng168080 - I thought about bar joist, will look into it as it may let us go further on OC spacing, therefore reducing overall cost.

@Aesure - $27k delivered, not installed. These are simple parallel chords. Nothing mind blowing. As far as Alpine and Mitek, you know damn well they are running a cartel on setting standards that force the use of their puppets. I dont want to get started on conspiracies, but the control factor is disgusting. As for reuse fees, thats fair and im usually down to do that. To me its just crazy that truss design software is sooo rare "proprietary". For crying out loud, engineering trusses is as old as 2500 BC (look it up!!!) We have computers and software that can damn near wipe your ass and make you dinner while having an intelligent AI convo with you, but a mathematical software that calculates design is akin to Jesus Christ second coming??????? Give me a break...Screw Simpson, Mitel and Alpine for treating their software like access to plutonium were "special clearance" is needed, You, as an educated, licensed engineer should be able to access easily and do designs for whoever wants it. but they dont, because they want to FORCE the use of there puppet fabricators.

@Ron Redneck - unfortunately NV needs stamped trusses. I mean come on, we are a state of high morals and standards. Nevada is striving to always do the right thing, which is evidenced by the numerous busy legal brothels scattered across the state, unlimited alcohol promotion and consumption that is used to encourage the poor uneducated residents living here to squander their savings in a casino. YES, I can see why NV would want to require building standards to match their own moral compass.... hahaha

Its late, and Im just ranting some BS for ya!!!! PLUS, I want to add, you all know that Las Vegas is the "Trash Can" of America. All the rejects and losers from all other 50 states come here to spill their crap all over the place. But Hey, what happens in Vegas stays in vegas!!!

 

[1503-44]

The hardest job the software does is printing out the settings for the saws to cut the angles at the joints.

Jeeps, what's the o/o height of the truss. 1:12 gives something like 2 to 5.33 ft? Or do you have 0 to 3.33 ?




--Einstein gave the same test to students every year. When asked why he would do something like that, "Because the answers had changed."

 

[jepps3]

@1503-44. Check out the image:

 

[jepps3]

Yep!!! $27k for this bullsh*t

 

[jhnblgr]

How many trusses are required?
What loads are on the trusses?
Typically I have found there’s more to the story when things like this happen, like the builder has a history of not paying bills.

 

[phamENG]

In my area that truss would require a special hauling permit and would add a lot to the cost. Not sure how restrictive NV DOT is or what sort of municipalities it has to pass through.

 

[XR250]

Can you install a mid-span beam and then stick frame the rafters?

 

[BridgeSmith]

For the design, and then fabrication of 20+ trusses (I'm assuming the building is more than 40' long) of that size and complexity, and then delivery of those trusses, $27k doesn't seem unreasonable to me.

 

[LittleInch]

OP said 2,500 sq ft flat roof so about 40 x 60 at 2 foot centres is about 30?

Maybe not all the same?

So about $1k per rafter including all design and stamping and delivery?

Not sure how any one of state is doing that for $500 a rafter.

Remember - More details = better answers
Also: If you get a response it's polite to respond to it.

 

[jepps3]

@bridgsmith - us developers are going to start a #metoo movement on truss fabricators taking advantage.

@lilinch - there are some small out of state shops with very small crews that are not that busy. They have lower volume plate presses that can’t meet the speed requirement of larger builders. So their small shops do nice little jobs and do well. I don’t need the speed as I order well in advance and I don’t have 1000 homes going at the same time.


@XR250 - foundation and footers already poured, so I don’t think the posts needed for a mid span beam could be facilitated. But in hind site I wish I would have thought about that. I just wasn’t aware of the recent all out exploitation carried out by truss fabricators these days. The raping is unreal, and no lube givin to builders to ease the pain as a courtesy while the truss companies take advantage.

#meetoo

 

[1503-44]

I imagine the reason they don't call back is ... deflection limits will fail under even minimal loads. Top and bottom chords separation need to be at least 3ft. Roughly 10% of span. It could maybe be less on one side, but for wood you need to have an average of 3 to 4ft separation. You are well into steel truss territory. What live load does this carry?

--Einstein gave the same test to students every year. When asked why he would do something like that, "Because the answers had changed."

 

[Eng16080]

Based on a recent project we designed in the Northeast, OP's truss price seems really high. We were quoted about $36k for a 5,000 SF roof with trusses spanning 52 ft and a ground snow load of 80 psf. Obviously this isn't apples to apples given we're on the other end of the country.

I would look into stick framing assuming the price of lumber there isn't also outrageous. Is there really no available internal support for these houses? At least around here it's not that common to need to clear span 40 ft.

 

[1503-44]

I'm seeing 2 to even 3 times the old lumber prices lately.

--Einstein gave the same test to students every year. When asked why he would do something like that, "Because the answers had changed."

 

[BridgeSmith]

@bridgsmith - us developers are going to start a #metoo movement on truss fabricators taking advantage.

Good luck with that.

 

[LittleInch]

So jepps3 - after 56 posts - what are you going to do?
Build your own trusses?
Start a truss company as they are clearly making a lot of money
Run for the state parliament on a ticket of not needing stamped drawings for trusses?

Don't leave us in suspension....

Remember - More details = better answers
Also: If you get a response it's polite to respond to it.

 

[RontheRedneck]

jhnblgr said: "Typically I have found there’s more to the story when things like this happen, like the builder has a history of not paying bills."

That's definitely the case. Sometimes.

If I know a customer is a huge pain in the ass I'll bump his price up. If a customer changes things over and over and over (I've re-bid things as many as a dozen times) the margin can go up a bit each time. If the plan is terrible and experience tells me we don't want that job - The price goes up.

Just for the heck of it I input the truss that the OP posted a picture of. There sure are a lot of pieces in it. There's absolutely no reason for that.

I re-ran the truss the way I would suggest doing it:

Two noteworthy things. One is that I put in verticals at the walls so the framer would not have to cut sloped top plates. Second is that I used a hell of a lot fewer pieces.

I priced both trusses while I was at it. The truss the OP showed was $410. The one I ran was $330.

Someone mentioned the depth of the truss. Making it a little deeper would reduce the forces. That would mean smaller plates and possibly lower lumber grades, which would reduce the price of the trusses a bit more.

 

[1503-44]

Smaller than 2x4 not possible.
Smaller plates, yes, but not too significant a cost.
Smaller deflection... VERY SIGNIFICANT. YOU NEED THE DEPTH.
That will fail deflection limits and may vibrate like hell with the right wind speed.
Depth is much more helpful than larger lumber.
Even if I could, I would not stamp it.