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NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface 30
- Thread starter ppknoop
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![[smile]](/data/assets/smilies/smile.gif "[smile] [smile]")
JohnRBaker
Mechanical
dhusk09 said:
Generally speaking, as long as the functions themselves which are being called by a Journal have not changed (and we we don't mean changes in the appearance or where something was found in the UI, but rather at the functional level itself) then the Journal should still run on the latest version of NX.
What is captured in a Journal, unlike with the older Macros, are the actual system-level calls for the functions being recorded. These are captured BELOW the User Interface level, meaning that even if we move a function from one menu to another or from one toolbar to another, or in the case of NX 9.0, we do away with the toolbars and menus altogether (at least when running in the Ribbon mode), this should have no impact whatsoever on the playing back of the Journal even if it's while running on a later version of NX. In fact, in NX 9.0 you could record a Journal in either the Ribbon or the 'classic UI' mode and you'd still be able to play it back in the other UI mode with no problems.
John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:
To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.
Millimeter
Mechanical
When I started reading this thread I thought, - This is a catastrophe! Siemens is porting the Solid Edge interface to NX!
But after seeing the screenshots I must say, that is refreshing and awesome.![[thumbsup2]](/data/assets/smilies/thumbsup2.gif "[thumbsup2] [thumbsup2]")
Thanks John R. Baker.
But after seeing the screenshots I must say, that is refreshing and awesome.
Thanks John R. Baker.
bartbrejcha
New member
ribbon is microsoft standard. I like it.
I could put together a few enhancement ideas for updating sketcher after playing with 9.0 later in the month.
I could put together a few enhancement ideas for updating sketcher after playing with 9.0 later in the month.
JohnRBaker
Mechanical
The NX 9.0 'Whats New' document lists 16 items under 'Advanced Simulation':
John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:
To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.
John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:
To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.
-
1
- #27
So we spent X million dollars on replacing the user interface and made sure that all the flaws and deficiencies in the ribbon bar had workarounds, Now, -Did we actually make something better ? -Did we reduce time to market ? -Make workflows quicker ? -Can the blend feature now handle that 5 edge vertice or is it marketing ?
Regards,
Tomas
Regards,
Tomas
-
2
- #28
I'd like to add my 2 cents having just taken part in the UK beta testing. Basically I hate the ribbon interface and I'm dreading the day I have to unlease it on our 600 users. I really think Siemens have missed a trick with the interface, the ribbon interface works well with microsoft applications where there are a couple of hundred commands, but NX supports over 3000 commands. I honestly felt lost using it and wish that the development had spent more time in developoin the ful screen capability and the way the menus are accessed from there, perhaps instead of following microsofts lead, they should have looked to apple and their coverflow method of browsing music could have easily been applied to the menus.
There is some fantastic stuff coming up, don't get me wrong, however the pain I'm going to have to go through converting some of our engineers who are so resistant to change doesn't bare thinking about. Me? I've always been as JRB says 'evangelistic' about NX, I'm a big fan of the software, and I'm sure I'll get to grips with is, but I'm afraid this is a step in the total wrong direction, in my humble opinion, Siemens have, as we say in the UK, 'dropped a bollock'.
Si
Best regards
Simon NX 7.5.4.4 MP8 and NX 8.5 (native) - TC 8
There is some fantastic stuff coming up, don't get me wrong, however the pain I'm going to have to go through converting some of our engineers who are so resistant to change doesn't bare thinking about. Me? I've always been as JRB says 'evangelistic' about NX, I'm a big fan of the software, and I'm sure I'll get to grips with is, but I'm afraid this is a step in the total wrong direction, in my humble opinion, Siemens have, as we say in the UK, 'dropped a bollock'.
Si
Best regards
Simon NX 7.5.4.4 MP8 and NX 8.5 (native) - TC 8
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1
- #29
The ribbon interface is coming from 2 directions.
1) Microsoft is developing the tools and code to make programming into a ribbon interface easy for the developers.
2) The other CAD companies have already done the ribbon interface and NX is playing catch up. Wildfire5 introduced it to us in 2008/2009. Creo in 2010 spread it across the whole system. SE and SW already have it, too.
Since John's pictures don't show up when I view Eng-Tips at work, I have not seen what he posted.
Simon makes a good point about the number of commands in the application. Creo is like NX, thousands of commands and which ones do you group together. MS Office products may have 20% of the commands a CAD system has making it easier to put into the ribbon interface.
"Wildfires are dangerous, hard to control, and economically catastrophic."
Ben Loosli
1) Microsoft is developing the tools and code to make programming into a ribbon interface easy for the developers.
2) The other CAD companies have already done the ribbon interface and NX is playing catch up. Wildfire5 introduced it to us in 2008/2009. Creo in 2010 spread it across the whole system. SE and SW already have it, too.
Since John's pictures don't show up when I view Eng-Tips at work, I have not seen what he posted.
Simon makes a good point about the number of commands in the application. Creo is like NX, thousands of commands and which ones do you group together. MS Office products may have 20% of the commands a CAD system has making it easier to put into the ribbon interface.
"Wildfires are dangerous, hard to control, and economically catastrophic."
Ben Loosli
JohnRBaker
Mechanical
Sorry for the off-topic post, but I have to ask, is this the 'Peter Crookall' from down under fame?
John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:
To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.
JohnRBaker
Mechanical
For Ben, and anyone else who can't access photos from PhotoBucket, I've attached a zip file of images that I've posted in my replies.
As for the 'WHY' of this project, NX MUST remain a competitive product and we cannot do so if we cling to things like an old style user interface merely because it's the way we've always done it, which of course isn't true since the UI has changed many times since I first started using UG some 36 years ago. Besides, new engineers and designers coming into the workforce today are already using Ribbon-style interfaces on the products that they've been using like Office and perhaps even one of those 'other' CAD systems, and by us not keeping up, we run the risk of looking like a product that will NOT be able to do the job for new customers who are looking at replacing whatever their current systems are today (there is very little 'virgin' business out there except in developing countries, everywhere else, it's a replacement sell). We must remain competitive in BOTH functionality AND usability, and right now, having an 'old looking' UI gives the impression that NX will be less usable than a more modern looking system and even if we KNOW that this is not the case, it does little good if the customer decides to not even give NX a second look. We have to sell what the market is demanding, and before anyone comments on the idea that we're somehow ignoring the wishes of our existing customers, how are we expected to continue to provide the new and "fantastic stuff" for our current installed base if we go out of business?
I'm sorry, but we must move forward. As stated previously, we are going to continue to support, at least for a couple of releases, both the current menu/toolbar based UI as well as the new Ribbon interface, to allow our existing customers a period of time to make the transition.
As for our coming late to the market, while some may see this as us "playing catch-up" we did not make this decision lightly since we knew that there were concerns out there about how the Ribbon interface was being implemented in other products, both from Microsoft as well as other CAD systems (including one close to home) and therefore we spent extra time, and yes, extra resources, working on a UI architecture which we think addresses most, if not all, of the complaints that we have heard being expressed out in the marketplace. And we will continue to refine and improve what we've done, based on feedback from BOTH new AND existing customers, over the next several releases since we are committed to providing what we think will prove to be the best possible implementation of this this technology for use with what is a complex product, but one that we know our users must be able to use to design and manufacture their complex products. This is no different than any of the commitments we have made in the past and I think our track record proves that we generally deliver what we promise.
So while we appreciate and are listening to your concerns, we also ask that when you do get a chance to use NX 9.0 that you give the Ribbon interface a fair test and if you do see where we can make improvements, please feel free to let us know since our goal here is to provide the best and most usable products possible.
John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:
To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.
As for the 'WHY' of this project, NX MUST remain a competitive product and we cannot do so if we cling to things like an old style user interface merely because it's the way we've always done it, which of course isn't true since the UI has changed many times since I first started using UG some 36 years ago. Besides, new engineers and designers coming into the workforce today are already using Ribbon-style interfaces on the products that they've been using like Office and perhaps even one of those 'other' CAD systems, and by us not keeping up, we run the risk of looking like a product that will NOT be able to do the job for new customers who are looking at replacing whatever their current systems are today (there is very little 'virgin' business out there except in developing countries, everywhere else, it's a replacement sell). We must remain competitive in BOTH functionality AND usability, and right now, having an 'old looking' UI gives the impression that NX will be less usable than a more modern looking system and even if we KNOW that this is not the case, it does little good if the customer decides to not even give NX a second look. We have to sell what the market is demanding, and before anyone comments on the idea that we're somehow ignoring the wishes of our existing customers, how are we expected to continue to provide the new and "fantastic stuff" for our current installed base if we go out of business?
I'm sorry, but we must move forward. As stated previously, we are going to continue to support, at least for a couple of releases, both the current menu/toolbar based UI as well as the new Ribbon interface, to allow our existing customers a period of time to make the transition.
As for our coming late to the market, while some may see this as us "playing catch-up" we did not make this decision lightly since we knew that there were concerns out there about how the Ribbon interface was being implemented in other products, both from Microsoft as well as other CAD systems (including one close to home) and therefore we spent extra time, and yes, extra resources, working on a UI architecture which we think addresses most, if not all, of the complaints that we have heard being expressed out in the marketplace. And we will continue to refine and improve what we've done, based on feedback from BOTH new AND existing customers, over the next several releases since we are committed to providing what we think will prove to be the best possible implementation of this this technology for use with what is a complex product, but one that we know our users must be able to use to design and manufacture their complex products. This is no different than any of the commitments we have made in the past and I think our track record proves that we generally deliver what we promise.
So while we appreciate and are listening to your concerns, we also ask that when you do get a chance to use NX 9.0 that you give the Ribbon interface a fair test and if you do see where we can make improvements, please feel free to let us know since our goal here is to provide the best and most usable products possible.
John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:
To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.
JohnRBaker
Mechanical
Peter, please drop me an email (if you look at my ID and add the appropriate periods (.) and then add the logical 'address', I think it'll get to me OK) as I'd like to see how you've been doing these past few years since I last visted OZ and we tipped a few 'Cascades' together ![[cheers]](/data/assets/smilies/cheers.gif "[cheers] [cheers]")
John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:
To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.
John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:
To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.
PrintScaffold
Mechanical
I'll post my five cents here. Apart from NX I worked extensively in Autodesk Inventor. When Inventor switched to the ribbon interface, I tried it and immediately loved it and has been happy ever since. ![[love2]](/data/assets/smilies/love2.gif "[love2] [love2]")
I think it's going to be good in NX.
I think it's going to be good in NX.For what my opinion is worth, I would advise people to use the full screen mode with a single, customized floating toolbar palette that you access with the alt key.
Advantages are:
[ul]
[li]Maximum real estate[/li]
[li]Only the commands that you use are visible (nobody uses 3000 commands)[/li]
[li]Minimum time is wasted moving your eyes away from the work and looking for commands (the palette pops up right where your cursor is)[/li]
[li]No time is wasted switching between toolbars (or tabs)[/li]
[li]Use mouse gestures for maximum speed[/li]
[/ul]
Having this setup allows you to play NX like a piano, rather than getting distracted by the interface.
NX8.5 Win7SP1 64bit i7-3770K@4.3Ghz 16GB Quadro2000
Advantages are:
[ul]
[li]Maximum real estate[/li]
[li]Only the commands that you use are visible (nobody uses 3000 commands)[/li]
[li]Minimum time is wasted moving your eyes away from the work and looking for commands (the palette pops up right where your cursor is)[/li]
[li]No time is wasted switching between toolbars (or tabs)[/li]
[li]Use mouse gestures for maximum speed[/li]
[/ul]
Having this setup allows you to play NX like a piano, rather than getting distracted by the interface.
NX8.5 Win7SP1 64bit i7-3770K@4.3Ghz 16GB Quadro2000
I'm afraid to say I hate it 
I've been using Unigraphics since V16 but I've been looking at NX9 for the last month and it feels like 'change for change sake'. I feel the development time would have been better spent on more enhancements instead of changing the interface.
I've been using Unigraphics since V16 but I've been looking at NX9 for the last month and it feels like 'change for change sake'. I feel the development time would have been better spent on more enhancements instead of changing the interface.Anywhere to shut off the operation words? I have these icons memorized (for me, Chinese is next).......I don't need to see their descriptions. Descriptions take up too much space.
Proud Member of the Reality-Based Community..
[green]To the Toolmaker, your nice little cartoon drawing of your glass looks cool, but your solid model sucks. Do you want me to fix it, or are you going to take all week to get it back to me so I can get some work done?[/green]
Proud Member of the Reality-Based Community..
[green]To the Toolmaker, your nice little cartoon drawing of your glass looks cool, but your solid model sucks. Do you want me to fix it, or are you going to take all week to get it back to me so I can get some work done?[/green]
JohnRBaker
Mechanical
Are you're referring to the icons w/text that you're seeing in the NX 9.0 'ribbon' bar itself?
BTW, are you a beta tester or are your comments based only on what you've seen either here in the images that I've posted or what you have seen in a demo somewhere of NX 9.0?
John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:
To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.
BTW, are you a beta tester or are your comments based only on what you've seen either here in the images that I've posted or what you have seen in a demo somewhere of NX 9.0?
John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:
To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.
Yes, is there a way to shut off the text that is next to the icons?
Proud Member of the Reality-Based Community..
[green]To the Toolmaker, your nice little cartoon drawing of your glass looks cool, but your solid model sucks. Do you want me to fix it, or are you going to take all week to get it back to me so I can get some work done?[/green]
Proud Member of the Reality-Based Community..
[green]To the Toolmaker, your nice little cartoon drawing of your glass looks cool, but your solid model sucks. Do you want me to fix it, or are you going to take all week to get it back to me so I can get some work done?[/green]
JohnRBaker
Mechanical
OK, I'm going to assume that you're NOT a beta-tester, but rather are going only by what you've seen here in the images that I've posted.
Except for the large icons, all of the others that you see either in the Ribbon itself or in one of the 'Galleries', that is the Small or Medium sized icons, YES, you can optionally include the text next to the icons or not. For the large icons that you see in the Ribbon itself, they will always appear with text since the Ribbon has a fixed height and removing the text on large icons, since they can't be stacked, would not save any space anyway so we simply leave the text on. However, you do have the option of using large icons in a Gallery and in that case you will have the option to include the text or not.
Also note that we've changed the behavior with respect to what happens to the icons if you change the size of the window that NX is running in or if you're forced to change the display resolution of the screen, which often happens when you're using a laptop hooked to a projector that is not able to support the higher resolution of the laptop and you have to change to a resolution of 1280x1024 or even lower. Prior to NX 9.0, what would happen is that some of the icons in the toolbars which went beyond the edge of the now smaller effective window boundaries would be removed and replaced with a single set of double-chevrons '>>' indicating that some icons had been removed and you'd have to select these double-chevrons to get access to the 'missing' icons. This was always a problem when I was doing demos where they didn't have a new, high resolution projector and so to mitigate this situation, I created a special Role for use with a 1280x1024 display where I only included the absolute minimum number of icons needed for my demo so that I didn't have to mess with the double-chevrons during the demo. However, now with NX 9.0 what happens is that we try and keep the icons but remove the text if it doesn't fit (BTW, you'll have control over which of the Small icons in the Ribbon will be the first to lose their text versus which ones will hang on till there's no choice but to remove the text) and if you were to continue to reduce the window size or resolution, the 'groups' in the Ribbon will be converted into a sort of gallery or drop-down but at least one large icon will remain as a place-holder for this new 'gallery/drop-down'. So the point I'm making is that while it might appear that the text next to an icon is wasting space, if we really need that space later on, we will automatically give up the text before we start hiding the icons.
Anyway, I hope this helps with your concerns.
John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:
To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.
Except for the large icons, all of the others that you see either in the Ribbon itself or in one of the 'Galleries', that is the Small or Medium sized icons, YES, you can optionally include the text next to the icons or not. For the large icons that you see in the Ribbon itself, they will always appear with text since the Ribbon has a fixed height and removing the text on large icons, since they can't be stacked, would not save any space anyway so we simply leave the text on. However, you do have the option of using large icons in a Gallery and in that case you will have the option to include the text or not.
Also note that we've changed the behavior with respect to what happens to the icons if you change the size of the window that NX is running in or if you're forced to change the display resolution of the screen, which often happens when you're using a laptop hooked to a projector that is not able to support the higher resolution of the laptop and you have to change to a resolution of 1280x1024 or even lower. Prior to NX 9.0, what would happen is that some of the icons in the toolbars which went beyond the edge of the now smaller effective window boundaries would be removed and replaced with a single set of double-chevrons '>>' indicating that some icons had been removed and you'd have to select these double-chevrons to get access to the 'missing' icons. This was always a problem when I was doing demos where they didn't have a new, high resolution projector and so to mitigate this situation, I created a special Role for use with a 1280x1024 display where I only included the absolute minimum number of icons needed for my demo so that I didn't have to mess with the double-chevrons during the demo. However, now with NX 9.0 what happens is that we try and keep the icons but remove the text if it doesn't fit (BTW, you'll have control over which of the Small icons in the Ribbon will be the first to lose their text versus which ones will hang on till there's no choice but to remove the text) and if you were to continue to reduce the window size or resolution, the 'groups' in the Ribbon will be converted into a sort of gallery or drop-down but at least one large icon will remain as a place-holder for this new 'gallery/drop-down'. So the point I'm making is that while it might appear that the text next to an icon is wasting space, if we really need that space later on, we will automatically give up the text before we start hiding the icons.
Anyway, I hope this helps with your concerns.
John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:
To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.
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