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Tourist submersible visting the Titanic is missing 101
- Thread starter JohnRBaker
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1
- #42
verymadmac
Mechanical
If it isn't a composites issue there is also this bit "Notably, its 380-mm acrylic viewport, says Rush, is twice the size of any viewport on a competing submersible and should offer passengers unprecedented views of the waterscape." from here
I guess its a laminated acrylic, but one would expect it to come with a maintenance program & a long list of do not's.
I guess its a laminated acrylic, but one would expect it to come with a maintenance program & a long list of do not's.
If the viewport is only rated for 1300m that might cast a real shadow on all the traveller contracts that were signed. This might likely be the cause of a catastrophic failure. it's well beyond any factor of safety and the letter predates the 'voyage' by several months.
-----*****-----
So strange to see the singularity approaching while the entire planet is rapidly turning into a hellscape. -John Coates
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- #45
Brian Malone
Industrial
The situation with the Titan is certainly dire but I see Stockton Rush and his company not as a bunch of wild cowboys shirking safety and collecting money. Stockton, the CEO of Oceangate, is the pilot of the submersible- he risks his life on technology he either designed, commissioned the design, assembled and/or participated in assembly. I think his piloting the vessel indicates he trusted the engineering and construction. Bravery and adventure are often tied together. Certainly, Oceangate is trying to commercialize deep water diving but innovation has a cost. The main choices are government grants or private investment. In what manner is what he is doing different than the past first steps by Barton and Beebe, Auguste and Jacques Piccard? They took risks and pushed boundaries. Just because the price tag of a ride is high does not mean this submersible and its operation is being done by idiots. Anyone who will design and build their own submersible or airplane or rocket and then get in it as the pilot has my respect. I hope for the best for the crew and passengers in Titan.
TugboatEng
Marine/Ocean
In one of the videos they said the viewport would fail optically before it failed catastrophically so the crew would know to abort. I don't know a lot about acrylic plastic but I do know it's prone to shattering which is why that obnoxious yellow turning polycarbonate is used for the lenses on the front of our cars.
Cool_Controls
Electrical
I'm fairly certain that Barton and Beebe, Auguste and Jacques Piccard didn`t kill any tourist with their hubris or innovations. Stockton on the other hand, time will tell.
enginesrus
Mechanical
An interesting video about this topic.
I'm guessing a titanium rim to hull glue failure, due to the hull flexing.
Only one way in it and out, bolts holding the hatch, can only be opened from outside.
I'm guessing a titanium rim to hull glue failure, due to the hull flexing.
Only one way in it and out, bolts holding the hatch, can only be opened from outside.
TugboatEng
Marine/Ocean
It wasn't due to flexing. The epoxy is more tolerant of flexing than both the carbon fiber tube and the titanium shell...
![[ponder]](/data/assets/smilies/ponder.gif "[ponder] [ponder]")
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- #51
![[tongue]](/data/assets/smilies/tongue.gif "[tongue] [tongue]")
Brian Malone
Industrial
This former passenger mirrors the sentiment I heard expressed by David Pogue (who has also traveled in the Titan): those who sign up to go for a dive are not 'tourists' - they are paying to be explorers and are doing this with eyes wide open and with about eight pages of signed waivers and explanations of potential harm and/or death.
Those with money to spend are not necessarily less technically adept than those of us with less to spend. I don't think Oceangate has buffaloed any of its moneyed passengers into paying for a dive and fooling them into thinking this is a Princess cruise or risk-free.
I don't personally know Stockton Rush, nor am I informed enough to defend his motivations or pedigree but certainly the risk of what is being done at Oceangate is no different than the risk being taken by the private entrepreneurs and companies pushing to go into space.
Those with money to spend are not necessarily less technically adept than those of us with less to spend. I don't think Oceangate has buffaloed any of its moneyed passengers into paying for a dive and fooling them into thinking this is a Princess cruise or risk-free.
I don't personally know Stockton Rush, nor am I informed enough to defend his motivations or pedigree but certainly the risk of what is being done at Oceangate is no different than the risk being taken by the private entrepreneurs and companies pushing to go into space.
Alistair_Heaton
Mechanical
A bit of hope...
Unfortunately it seems to be going the same way as the Kursk with ego's at play. Why on earth would you block a civilain support vessel from a NATO country?
Brian Malone
Industrial
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- #56
LittleInch
Petroleum
hacksaw,
Add to that no plan B or rescue capability. They only had one on the vessel so lose it and you can't send down another one to find it.
If there are sounds then it sounds a lot more like it is snagged or caught on something and doesn't have the capability or power to escape.
The reliability of the "safety" devices also seems rather questionable given there apparent off the shelf use of domestic or simple industrial components.
I still can't work out how any power or signals got from inside the craft to the units themselves. Were there ports on the titanium shell?
Remember - More details = better answers
Also: If you get a response it's polite to respond to it.
Add to that no plan B or rescue capability. They only had one on the vessel so lose it and you can't send down another one to find it.
If there are sounds then it sounds a lot more like it is snagged or caught on something and doesn't have the capability or power to escape.
The reliability of the "safety" devices also seems rather questionable given there apparent off the shelf use of domestic or simple industrial components.
I still can't work out how any power or signals got from inside the craft to the units themselves. Were there ports on the titanium shell?
Remember - More details = better answers
Also: If you get a response it's polite to respond to it.
There are a few high pressure feed throughs,but no mechanical overrides.
In 2018 the company settled out of court, after an engineer repeatedly raised serious concerns about strength testing of the design, a design only rated for 1000 m.
It appears to have plenty of cameras and joy sticks.
Alistair_Heaton
Mechanical
Apparently there is a rated rov which has manipulators on it that are strong enough to grab it and haul it up.
But it's in Guernsey channel Islands ready to go but it's being refused an import license by the USA so far 3 times.
But it's in Guernsey channel Islands ready to go but it's being refused an import license by the USA so far 3 times.
AH-
Why would it have to go to the US? Canada is the nearest landmass and if it's flown to the US it's many hundreds of miles away, so wouldn't make it in time anyway (probably still wouldn't from anywhere). That's all considering that we know where it is and it can even be retrieved.
Don't get mad at me. Asking for a friend![[bigsmile]](/data/assets/smilies/bigsmile.gif "[bigsmile] [bigsmile]")
Brad Waybright
The more you know, the more you know you don't know.
Why would it have to go to the US? Canada is the nearest landmass and if it's flown to the US it's many hundreds of miles away, so wouldn't make it in time anyway (probably still wouldn't from anywhere). That's all considering that we know where it is and it can even be retrieved.
Don't get mad at me. Asking for a friend
Brad Waybright
The more you know, the more you know you don't know.
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