Miami Beach, Champlain Towers South apartment building collapse, Part 08 20

[SFCharlie]

A continuation of our discussion of this failure. Best to read the other threads first to avoid rehashing things already discussed.
Miami Beach, Champlain Towers South apartment building collapse
Miami Beach, Champlain Towers South apartment building collapse, Part 02
Miami Beach, Champlain Towers South apartment building collapse, Part 03
Miami Beach, Champlain Towers South apartment building collapse, Part 04
Miami Beach, Champlain Towers South apartment building collapse, Part 05
Miami Beach, Champlain Towers South apartment building collapse, Part 06
Miami Beach, Champlain Towers South apartment building collapse, Part 07

SF Charlie
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[Phil1934]

Not new guidelines. Crist did away with 5 year inspections in 2010 suggesting no one had the value of hindsight 11 years ago. "We didn't have Surfside then," he said.

https://www.news-journalonline.com/...-2010-repeal-condo-inspection-law/7962325002/

 

[dragon6172]

MarkBob2,

In photo 2 of your Powerpoint you mark two cars and ask "Is one of these cars parked in a driving lane? Something is not right here."

These two cars can be seen in this picture... they are in the guest parking in marked spots.

 

[gonefishing2]

MarkBob2, I am having a hard time seeing what you see, but my laptop is a 2012 model....... and after Spartan5's Trail Mix BM, I don't think I can see or want to see anything clearly anymore......... Way TMI.......

 

[Sym P. le]

Devil's advocate back again. Is the cubic grey item a test weight for a crane and is the water draining from the deck drains, the implication being an initial partial deck collapse?

Frame grab from USA Today video

View of back of stall 27 from Youtube video of Unit 611 tour (near the end)

EDIT: deck drains are likely planter drains from initial construction

 

[gonefishing2]

Interest thought, and that would explain it looking like raw unfinished concrete cube .......

Or counter balance weight for a swing stage hanging over parapet wall from I-Beam sitting on top of scaffolding......

There is nothing good to tie back end of swing stage counter balance to, at ground level on an suspect elevated garage, therefore a counter weight on swing stage makes a lot of sense with only crappy parapet walls to anchor to...

 

[MarkBoB2]

Can anyone explain why the recovery crew left this small pile of debris near the end of the ramp for two days when they cleared the area of the parking basement behind it? Was it because there was one or more objects of interest in the pile?

 

[gonefishing2]

MarkBob2,

I clearly think there were objects of interest in that pile, and I can see some of the man made objects, just not clearly enough to validate what I am seeing on an old laptop screen with old eyes too.....

 

[Demented]

Has any scaffolding been found on the site? It would have been on the north side, likely in view of the tiktok video witness.

Edit:
Sand bags in FL might be more likely as counter balance. Each crew/company is different though

Precision guess work based on information provided by those of questionable knowledge

 

[gonefishing2]

MarkBoB2,

There is an interesting steel channel in one of your pictures, that I wonder where it came from? It looks like something a contractor would be dragging around from job to job, and not something that would have been installed as part of CTS.

 

[gonefishing2]

So a Cubic Yard of Concrete weights up to the 4000 lb nominal range???

Edit: F=ma

 

[SwinnyGG]

Sand bags in FL might be more likely as counter balance. Each crew/company is different though

Sand bags for counterweight of scaffolding or davits are a pretty serious OSHA violation.. I wouldn't attribute any sand bags to that.

 

[Demented]

I'm guessing you didn't see the pictures of the forklift and ladder, or the welded fire escape doors.

OSHA violations are far too common in this area, especially serious ones.

Oh well. Lunch is over. Back I go to unpermitted and not enginered ocean front construction.

Precision guess work based on information provided by those of questionable knowledge

 

[Optical98]

Eufalconimorph with the Gigapixel software...

Maybe you could use that software on the "mystery of what's beyond the Gated Ramp" photo? Prob best to start with an original photo vs anything we can link on here, or just a few posts above this one, Sym P linked one. I'd love to see what you could do with that!

 

[Reverse_Bias]

Does the plaza/deck collapse really need a trigger?

It looks like it was more of a gradual degradation slab until it reached a tipping point. Eventually it couldn't handle nighttime parked car load and it just caved in.

I know I've hung plenty of suction cups on the fridge that just fall of in the middle of the night when nothing was near it. One time I even left my dresser drawers open and it fell over several hours later. Nothing needed to come off the roof, and no car needed to hit it.

 

[Sym P. le]

Using the frame posted above from the USA Today video along with a superimposed cutout of column 27 from the 611 tour video (scaled from the top of the numeral 27 to the top of the yellow band), it is obvious that we see the floor of the parkade, not a slab drop from above, at least in the driving aisle. The debris in the aisle likely tumbled in from adjacent areas or includes chunks from overhead but not a complete section drop of that area.

 

[Sym P. le]

Does the plaza/deck collapse really need a trigger?

More than likely yes, and the video demands an explanation. No credible report can skip this evidence.

Having said that, I suspect the investigation is way ahead of us.

 

[MaudSTL]

Eventually it couldn't handle nighttime parked car load and it just caved in.

No one has interviewed Shamoka Furman, the security guard who was in the lobby next to the surface car park. We know she heard the “collapsed wall” of the first collapse, which brought Sara Nir to the lobby to complain. What is less clear is whether Shamoka also heard the knocking sounds that Chani Nir says she heard as soon as she got to 111 at 11 PM. Those knocking sounds from above went on for two hours or longer, becoming increasingly “intense.”

No one who used the garage around that time has so far reported hearing the knocking sounds in the garage. Eric Zion has not stated he heard them in the garage at 10:30 (arrived with his wife), 11:30 (left with his wife,) or 12:30 (arrived alone.) Just before 12:30, Sara and Gabe Nir parked in the garage when they got home, and so far neither has stated they heard the knocking sounds down there. At around 1:15, Nicolas Vazquez stated he only heard a loud creaking sound a few seconds before he and his wife got on the elevator in the garage.

 

[Spartan5]

Can anyone explain why the recovery crew left this small pile of debris near the end of the ramp for two days when they cleared the area of the parking basement behind it? Was it because there was one or more objects of interest in the pile?

As others have told you repeatedly, red paint denotes the presence or potential for human remains. Most likely that a cadaver dog had hit on this area of the pile.

None of your the items identified through your theoretical squinting have visible paint on them.

 

[Spartan5]

We know she heard the “collapsed wall” of the first collapse.

Source for that quote?

 

[MarkBoB2]

Optical98 asked:

Maybe you could use that software on the "mystery of what's beyond the Gated Ramp" photo? Prob best to start with an original photo vs anything we can link on here, or just a few posts above this one, Sym P linked one. I'd love to see what you could do with that!

The "gated Ramp" photo was from a TicToc video taken using a cell camera having a very limited resolution. My computer and high resolution display cannot increase this image resolution when it it limited by the camera in the first place. The photos of the debris pile that I have shown were taken by a high resolution camera on a drone or by a high resolution still camera while standing near the ramp area. These photos are clearly of professional image quality made by someone who could afford a camera with high quality optics.