Things are Starting to Heat Up - Part XII 23

[dik]

For earlier threads, see:
thread1618-496010
thread1618-496614
thread1618-497017
thread1618-497239
thread1618-497988
thread1618-498967
thread1618-501135
thread1618-504850
thread1618-506948
thread1618-507973
thread1618-510266


-----*****-----
So strange to see the singularity approaching while the entire planet is rapidly turning into a hellscape. -John Coates

-Dik

 

[dik]

Things are looking up...

"Finnish start-up company Aircohol is pioneering the creation of a vodka-like spirit using carbon dioxide (CO2) extracted directly from the atmosphere.

This ground-breaking approach has the potential to reduce the industry’s carbon footprint by an astonishing 50 per cent. As they say in their own words ‘Aircohol is about saving the planet in a cheerful way!’

At the core of the process is a bioreactor that converts CO2 into alcohol through a two-day fermentation process, all while avoiding the emission of greenhouse gases."

https://euroweeklynews.com/2024/01/16/innovative-finnish-company-makes-sustainable-alcohol/

-----*****-----
So strange to see the singularity approaching while the entire planet is rapidly turning into a hellscape. -John Coates

-Dik

 

[GregLocock]

I must admit I prefer the natural bioreactors that turn atmospheric CO2 into wine, but each to his own. I'll be honest this smelt a bit fishy, but

https://news.uchicago.edu/story/new-catalyst-can-make-ethanol-out-carbon-dioxide.

Cheers

Greg Locock


New here? Try reading these, they might help FAQ731-376

http://eng-tips.com/market.cfm?

 

[BridgeSmith]

If only there was a way to convert CO2 and water into energy-producing compounds using sunlight...

 

[TugboatEng]

That is one number that I have not been able to find is the efficiency of photosynthesis at making hydrocarbons vs the efficiency of solar panels at making electricity.

 

[GregLocock]

Wiki says

The photosynthetic efficiency is the fraction of light energy converted into chemical energy during photosynthesis in green plants and algae. Photosynthesis can be described by the simplified chemical reaction

6 H2O + 6 CO2 + energy → C6H12O6 + 6 O2
where C6H12O6 is glucose (which is subsequently transformed into other sugars, starches, cellulose, lignin, and so forth). The value of the photosynthetic efficiency is dependent on how light energy is defined – it depends on whether we count only the light that is absorbed, and on what kind of light is used (see Photosynthetically active radiation). It takes eight (or perhaps ten or more[1]) photons to use one molecule of CO2. The Gibbs free energy for converting a mole of CO2 to glucose is 114 kcal, whereas eight moles of photons of wavelength 600 nm contains 381 kcal, giving a nominal efficiency of 30%.[2] However, photosynthesis can occur with light up to wavelength 720 nm so long as there is also light at wavelengths below 680 nm to keep Photosystem II operating (see Chlorophyll). Using longer wavelengths means less light energy is needed for the same number of photons and therefore for the same amount of photosynthesis. For actual sunlight, where only 45% of the light is in the photosynthetically active wavelength range, the theoretical maximum efficiency of solar energy conversion is approximately 11%. In actuality, however, plants do not absorb all incoming sunlight (due to reflection, respiration requirements of photosynthesis and the need for optimal solar radiation levels) and do not convert all harvested energy into biomass, which results in a maximum overall photosynthetic efficiency of 3 to 6% of total solar radiation.[1] If photosynthesis is inefficient, excess light energy must be dissipated to avoid damaging the photosynthetic apparatus. Energy can be dissipated as heat (non-photochemical quenching), or emitted as chlorophyll fluorescence.

PV can be 40%, but that is very expensive, typical domestic is 22% or so

Cheers

Greg Locock


New here? Try reading these, they might help FAQ731-376

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[BridgeSmith]

PV solar cells don't remove CO2 from the atmosphere, or produce Oxygen, but plants do. With the Earth getting greener, more CO2 is being absorbed by plants. As plant life becomes more vigorous, due to more CO2, and expands over more area, due to increased precipitation and decreased ice cover, will the atmospheric CO2 levels stabilize, even without drastic and catastrophic actions by humans? Possibly. Seems likely to me that eventually it will balance out, likely with warmer temperatures (sounds good to me; I'm freezing my butt off), but also with a larger volume and more productive vegetation (i.e. more food for animals and people), over more land mass (more habitable land for humans and animals).

 

[JoshPlumSE]

There are so many things about Global Warming that we don't fully understand. We know the earth is warming. We're pretty confident that CO2 pays a roll. But, we don't know how much and we don't know how serious other potential causing of warming are.

Is it possible that we find out that all the methane and natural gas that is accidentally released into the air when we're harvesting other fossil fuels is a major contributor? Yes, that is very possible.

Is it possible that the warming we saw in the 80, 90's and such was more severe because of the whole in the Ozone layer (which has mostly repaired)? Yes, that's possible too.

Is it possible that the sun's energy is going through a cycle? Yes, it is.

The key takeaway for me is that we have good reasons to strive for more efficiency in our power production and reduce our CO2 emissions. But, it would be idiotic to commit economic suicide to prevent a climate disaster that is almost certainly NOT coming.

 

[dik]

The correlation between these two curves could be indicative of the amount of heat in the near future; the earth is playing catch-up I suspect.

in view of the records set last year may be a bit of an inkling...

https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-67861954

We'll see if 2024 is any different than 2023... I suspect there will be more records broken.



-----*****-----
So strange to see the singularity approaching while the entire planet is rapidly turning into a hellscape. -John Coates

-Dik

 

[JoshPlumSE]

dik -

Look at the curve of climate related deaths. They've gone down exponentially over the last 150 years. The same time during which our CO2 emissions have gone up. The correlation would imply that the more CO2 we release, the safer we'll be from climate.

You get my point. Right? Correlation does not mean causation. Certainly, in this case, the REASON that climate deaths have gone down is we've made society a lot safer. What has driven that safety is ample and affordable energy. Whether it be heating your house during freezing weather. Cooling it during hot spells, or driving away from your house when a hurricane is coming..... Cheap and affordable energy has helped us a lot MORE than it has hurt us.

Now. we may see this trend of reduced climate deaths slow down, plateau or slightly reverse. But, rising CO2 on it's own is extremely unlikely to completely reverse this trend. However, completely destroying our economy will almost CERTAINLY reverse it. How? The most simple way possible. We've already seen what these policies do in Europe.... high energy prices will cause people to freeze in the winter and succumb to heat in the summer.

The main point is that we can certainly strive to reduce our CO2 emissions, but we must do so in a responsible and efficient way. If we go too extreme then the DAMAGE we cause with these ill advised policies will be way, way, way worse than what we were trying to prevent.

 

[dik]

This has largely been explained because of the early warning provided. Looking around the weather seems to have gotten much more severe.

-----*****-----
So strange to see the singularity approaching while the entire planet is rapidly turning into a hellscape. -John Coates

-Dik

 

[BridgeSmith]

Looking around the weather seems to have gotten much more severe.

I key word in that is "seems". From what I've read weather events have not gotten more severe, we just hear more about them. They also do more damage and more expensive damage because people are building more and more expensive infrastructure in high risk areas. Add to that people not expecting to endure hardships, or even be inconvenienced, coupled with the declining ability of the populace to take care of themselves and others in a severe weather event, and what used to be normal is now considered catastrophic.

Just as an example, consider New Orleans during Katrina. You have a city, most of which is below the level of the water nearly all the way around it, and almost nobody had a plan for a flood, or a boat of any kind. If I lived there, something that floats would be the #1 item in my emergency kit.

 

[GregLocock]

No, the weather has not got more severe, in general. It is better reported, and there are more people and infrastructure to be affected by it.

There are also a team of professionals whose job is to exaggerate any bad trends and blame climate change for them and feed those stories to a gullible set of clowns in the media to write scary headlines that end up on eng-tips. That sounds like a conspiracy theory, it is not.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Weather_Attribution

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/feat...ate-scientists-do-extreme-weather-attribution

https://www.climatechangecommunication.org

(there are others)


Cheers

Greg Locock


New here? Try reading these, they might help FAQ731-376

http://eng-tips.com/market.cfm?

 

[TugboatEng]

Josh, you need to express climate related deaths as "per capita"...

 

[dik]

Even with advanced warning... this could be the beginning of more and greater anomalies...

"Nearly 90 weather-related deaths have been recorded across the US after the country was pummelled by ferocious winter storms for the past week.

The deaths include at least 25 in Tennessee and 16 in Oregon, which remains under a state of emergency following severe ice storms.
Tens of thousands of people also remain without power across wide swathes of the country.

Icy conditions are expected to continue until the middle of the week.

A total of 89 weather-related fatalities have been recorded across the country over the past week, according to a tally maintained by CBS, the BBC's US partner.

While the death toll has been greatest in Tennessee and Oregon, fatalities have also been reported in Illinois, Pennsylvania, Mississippi, Washington, Kentucky, Wisconsin, New York, New Jersey and elsewhere."

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-68049923

-----*****-----
So strange to see the singularity approaching while the entire planet is rapidly turning into a hellscape. -John Coates

-Dik

 

[BridgeSmith]

The deaths include at least 25 in Tennessee and 16 in Oregon, which remains under a state of emergency following severe ice storms.
Tens of thousands of people also remain without power across wide swathes of the country.

Icy conditions are expected to continue until the middle of the week.

Do you not see the irony/hypocrisy in using weather events related to unusual cold in order to advocate for cutting CO2 emissions to reduce warming?

 

[dik]

Things just got a whole lot more interesting:

"Oil giant ExxonMobil has sued climate activist investors in a bid to prevent their climate proposal from going to a vote at its annual investor meeting.

The complaint is against Follow This and Arjuna Capital, which have called on Exxon to step up the pace of reductions in greenhouse gas emissions.

Exxon says the US and Dutch investors are driven by an "extreme agenda".
It is rare for companies to go to court to block shareholder motions and this is the first time Exxon has done so."

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-68052440

I wonder if the following is likely. For countries with a population of over 100M people, the US has the highest per capita carbon footprint. China's is about half of theirs. The rest of the world (everyone but the US) cuts their per capita footprint, but the US doesn't, because they can't politically. In addition, it's really inconvenient to reduce the carbon footprint and do away with all the luxury items. What's the world to do?

-----*****-----
So strange to see the singularity approaching while the entire planet is rapidly turning into a hellscape. -John Coates

-Dik

 

[rb1957]

are we going to skip unlucky "13" ?

"Hoffen wir mal, dass alles gut geht !"
General Paulus, Nov 1942, outside Stalingrad after the launch of Operation Uranus.

 

[dik]

My brother and I were both born on a Friday 13...

-----*****-----
So strange to see the singularity approaching while the entire planet is rapidly turning into a hellscape. -John Coates

-Dik

 

[rb1957]

so was my son ...

"Hoffen wir mal, dass alles gut geht !"
General Paulus, Nov 1942, outside Stalingrad after the launch of Operation Uranus.

 

[sbisteel]

I wonder if the following is likely. For countries with a population of over 100M people, the US has the highest per capita carbon footprint. China's is about half of theirs. The rest of the world (everyone but the US) cuts their per capita footprint, but the US doesn't, because they can't politically. In addition, it's really inconvenient to reduce the carbon footprint and do away with all the luxury items. What's the world to do?

Republicans overturned Roe V. Wade, so I guess they've made some political progress in reducing per capita footprint.