Working 40 hrs/week....somewhat.... 4

[zoltecrules]

Just thought I would share this little nugget...

Been working my current job for a little over 2 years now. The "recommended" hours were 7:45-4:30 (45 min lunch). My boss typically arrives around 7:30 AM and leaves around 6:00-7:30 P.M.

My first year, I lived about 45 min - 1hr away. At first, I would arrive around 7:45 and leave around 4:30-5:00. After awhile though, I got lazy and started to arrive around 8:15-9:45, but I would still would leave around 5:00-6:30. It was kind of easier to get work done since it was a little quieter after hours.

Probably a bad idea eh?

Just the opposite. My boss and other upper level employees started to compliment me on my "extra effort" saying how my staying late really "Showed my dedication", especially compared to those employees that worked 6:45-3:30 that were considered "lazy".

My boss also liked to really get his hands dirty after normal hours at work, since that is the only time he is free. Although he's a manager, he really seems to enjoy doing a lot of the design engineer tasks that were meant for. In fact, he told me on several occasions how lucky I am because I get to work on all the "fun stuff" while all he gets to do is the dull management stuff. Kind of seems like a severe micromanager to me, but that's for another day.

Well, last summer, I finally got a place closer to work; less than 5 minutes in fact. I actually started showing up to work a little early than most people (7:30) and leaving a little later than most (5:00).

This is where it get interesting. At my most recent review, my boss told me my "effort has declined" and that I really should put more time into the job.

The funny thing is I've always worked a min of 40 hrs/week and most of the time more than that. I just think my boss only seems to notice when I'm here later in the day. My output of work if anything has improved since my knowledge has increased.

Should I:

1. Keep working the 7:30-5:00 and hope things improve?
2. Start coming in later again and try doing the "midnight oil" strategy?
3. Start working 7:30-7:30 so everyone notices I'm here? (just kidding on this one. I know if I asked my boss what time I should work this would be his response )

Any other ideas would be greatly appreciated too. I really don't mind working later these days either because there isn't much to do RIGHT after work Mon-Thurs.

Also, just to compare, the other 9 salaried employees in my department hours go like this:

3 work 6:45 - 3:30 (are considered "lazy")
2 work 7:45 - 4:30
2 work 8:15 - 5:00
1 works 9:15 - 6:00 (boss started complaining to him as of late)
1 works unusual hours since he's getting his BSME right now

 

[hokie66]

You young folks are really spoiled. When I was young, we worked 12 hour days plus 6 on Saturdays, and had to walk 2 miles through the snow to get there. And next year that will be 3 miles I had to walk, etc.

Seriously, I don't think you can do much about your boss's perception of your work habits without unduly punishing yourself. Maybe finding out if he works at all on the weekends and allowing him to catch you in the office a time or two.

 

[abusementpark]

I would go in from 800-600 and take an hour for lunch.

 

[IRstuff]

Put in the 8 hrs with the work day ending 6:15.

I've also noticed that working late gets more brownie points than working the same amount, but starting early.

TTFN

FAQ731-376

 

[zdas04]

What are you looking for here? You know what behaviour the boss rewards. You don't have a problem with the late hours. You don't appear to be stupid. What is the decision? I would come in at more or less random times so that any clock-watching co-worker couldn't keep a log, stay till 6:00 or so and feed the perceptions you want to feed.

40 hours a week would drive me nuts, but some people insist on it. Clock watchers never get ahead. If you want this boss to think you deserve reward, start at 7:30-8:30 and leave at 6:00 to 6:30. Eight to 6:00 is 10 hours, deduct an hour for lunch and call the extra 5 hours/week an investment in your future.

David

 

[mshimko]

As a manager, I've always thought poorly of other managers who (a) "graded" people on how their work hours matched the manager's, and (b) encouraged inefficiant work habits.

These views started when I was a junior officer on a Navy ship, and noticed others who worked very inefficiently during the day, just to make a show of being aboard "late" so the boss could see them.

Managers SHOULD, but many don't, recognize that, given a choice, not all people work the same hours.
- Some will work efficiently for 8 hours; others will work inefficiently for 10 hours. WHo is the better employee?
- Some people will arrive early and leave "on time"; others will arrive "on time" and leave late. Who is the better employee?

All that said, your manager is your manager, and you evidently recognize his work habits and and how he perceives the work habits of others. In the end, you'll do one of the following:
(a) work "your hours" and take the lower perception from the boss,
(b) try to communicate more with your boss and convince him how effective/efficient you are even though your hours do not match his,
(c) work "your manager's hours" to enhance his perception of you.

 

[jmw]

This may not be about your work at all.

"My boss also liked to really get his hands dirty after normal hours at work, since that is the only time he is free. Although he's a manager, he really seems to enjoy doing a lot of the design engineer tasks that were meant for."

After hours is when he gets to play and he obviously liked having a playmate, especially when he can be the boss showing his is still "one of the lads at heart" and you get to play diligent employee.
Thus the final option is to turn up at whatever time between 9 am and noon you like, take a three hour lunch then stay late to play.

JMW

http://www.ViscoAnalyser.com

 

[mechengdude]

Sounds like you are working at one of my old jobs with an old school engineering manager. I have also observed that coming in early and leaving early does not give as good of an impression as coming in late and staying late.

Now back to your question. What are you looking to acheive? I will make an assumption and guess a bigger raise at review time. If thats your goal then change to the late-late schedule.

One other thing. To elude to other threads, don't spend that extra .5% raise all in one place.

 

[zoltecrules]

Regarding what I want to achieve here, I really don't know right now. Both my raises have been quite reasonable (9% first year and 6.5% second).

But I really think promotions within the company are too far away for me. I'm 25 now and the only promotions I could possibly get are well, my bosses job (Engineering Manager) and the Product Development manager job, both of which look very unappealing to me anyway.

However, the company is paying for some education right now (Buisness Management for Engineers certification) and I'm hoping they would pay for a full grad degree later....

 

[ykee]

Since you are five mintues from home, I'd go for a 8-6 long lunch!

 

[KENAT]

Unless it interferes with your life outside work, which it doesn't sound like it will, you may as well play your boss.

If he likes you being there late make sure and stay late sometimes when it suits you.

Being so close to home you could take a longer lunch and actually get benefit from it.

What the boss says/is doing annoys me, I'm more concerned about work done than hours worked if you catch my drift. My boss loves when our interns etc work extra hours and gives them glowing recomendations. Trouble is some of the ones that have done the most extra hours have been the worst performing, they have to do the extra hours just to try and keep up. The 3 best interns we've had since I've been here have all been, if not quite clock watchers, close to it, not going much over required hours. However they get more done to a better standard than a lot of the others so who cares.

So long as you're there when required for interfacing with other staff/customers then I don't think it should matter if you work early, late or in the middle.

However, your boss clearly has a preference so unless it causes you a problem, play it.

If it does cause a problem then find something else. You could go to HR but that road rarely leads anywhere good.



KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...

 

[MechanicalChef]

Another tip: For non critical emails, use the feature in outlook which delays the sending of a message.

New email -> options -> "Do not send before: ______"

Send him a few on saturday's and sundays at close to midnight.

 

[zoltecrules]

I think my boss is obessesed with this staying late thing because he's a micromanager and to him 3:30-6:00 is the only time things actually "get done" (it's also the only time he gets to spend time with his employees).

Oh and I would have to defintley agree with you on the quantity over quality when it comes to time. There's an employee here that gets more done in a 8 hour period than another employee does in an 10 hour period. Why? Because the 10 hour employee spends 2-3 hours a day goofing off.

 

[TheTick]

Come in at 6:00
Take a 2+ hour lunch break
Work at McDonald's during lunch rush
Work late

Your boss likes you because he sees you there late.
The other early birds see you as one of them.
You make extra money in the time that would otherwise have been stolen from you.

 

[whyun]

Your boss is who he is and probably won't change.

Since you live so close to work, try to be at work before your boss (and make your presense known when he comes in) and leave when your boss leaves. Have a few minute chat about the job or whatever with your boss before you leave. Put in your honest 40 hours but increase your "personal time" while you are at work.

Other than being somewhat of a micromanager, I have no idea how useful your boss is in terms of technical mentoring. If you ARE learning, maximize that opportunity.

 

[dbooker630]

I agree with mechengdude about the later work hours making more of an impression.

When I started at my current position five years ago, the core hours were 7:30-4:30 with an hour lunch. In these days of insufficient staffing, more often than not in order to get something done I wound up staying well past 6pm most days. It seems like the core hours are spent attending to other's requests, which is expected since I'm responsible for laboratory services.

I've never been a morning person in 30 years of working, so the later hours suit me fine, there is no one to interrupt me when I need to work on a project, etc. So I started coming in at 8am and made it clear to everyone when I started my day. My experience has been that the early arrivals tend to leave early also, but I know I am generalizing. My boss knows that I put in 9-10 hours a day and has no problem with my schedule, I just have to put up with a few friendly jokes.

I would choose your option #2.

 

[vesselfab]

40 hours?
the last time I worked a 40 hour week was when I took a couple of days off.

 

[controlnovice]

Just be careful coming and leaving with your boss.

The rest of the team/co-workers may see that as a turn-coat/sucking up/brown nosing....

______________________________________________________________________________
This is normally the space where people post something insightful.

 

[HgTX]

I'm somewhat surprised at how many people are saying their bosses prefer late to early.

Around here, there's no problem with coming and leaving early (within legislative limits). Coming and leaving late (within legislative limits) is looked upon with the hairy eyeball. (I do it anyway. I'd have even later work hours if they'd let me, and they'd get a lot more out of me.)

My boss doesn't watch *my* clock, but he watches *his* clock. Out at 5 on the dot, unless he was late by X minutes, in which case he stays X minutes late. He's pretty lenient with me, though. He knows that all in all I work the requisite number of hours. (And we do track all hours on a timesheet.)

Hg

Eng-Tips policies: faq731-376

 

[calguy07]

i'm one of those early to leave. i put in my 8 hours and that's it. your results should speak for itself. i put my head down for 8 hrs and go home afterwards. i actually try to have a life...8 hours is plenty of time to get work done (i'm way ahead on projects and continue ask for more work). why work overtime??